Town of Troy Planning Board Meeting 5/21/2025

Speakers are labeled SPEAKER_N. This transcript is machine-generated.

Recording

on my property. He goes, "Because it's a
circle." He goes, "Because that's open
down there." He goes, "I could do that."
No, he doesn't have that right.
I mean, unless it's in your deed that
Oh, that and so then I just let the I
didn't go through there. I mowed. I let
all the trees grow up. So, it blocks it
off now. Hi, Carol. Can you hear us? Cuz
I was like, I don't want Yes, I can. My
kids are here.
Trying to call that
Freud Planning
Board
um open the meeting
at present with
myself vice
chair
secretary and Garyino
Um order of
business is the
draft meeting minute from May 7th.
[Music]
Pleasure.
and they are all shared on Facebook.
I'll make a motion to approve as
submitted.
Second
motion discussion.
All those in favor?
I told
extensions.
Um, next we are open for public comment.
Who call
me? So, you're too young to know, but
that's from a TV show called Welcome
Back Car.
Uh so the reason that I'm
here other than I gave this out is uh
Select Hopkins has given you a rundown
from the Senate
Republicans on a bunch of bills that are
coming before the House and they're
going to be relevant to
uh coming from the from coming from the
state. These are both Senate and House
bills that are
likely to or have already been passed
inside and
uh
so and I want to talk about that and
your master
plan.
Um, first of
all, I met with
the budget committee, which is one of my
responsibilities as a select one. I'm we
have our different
portfolios and my mine includes the
budget committee.
you were
there. And so the budget committee seems
to be more adamant than ever on looking
for a cost savings and a budget
reduction. Uh well, I that's a different
conversation with regard to that.
the master plan that we
have can be
reserved and I I mean it's great that we
did a survey and we found that everybody
hates the selectman like we didn't know
um if if we are not envisioning suddenly
changing the master plan in the town to
include a
helport or a shopping mall or something
like that. If we're going to stay with
essentially the same master plan we
have, the most cost effective thing that
we can do is reertify it. Not having a
properly certified master plan holds us
up on a number of other issues like
building a CIP, which is critical for
the financial future of the town.
And I would tell you that I mean you may
have I don't know if you have a price
from Southwestern. I mean if it's any
kind of significant
money it is not going to be met with
warm fuzzies by either the select board
or the budget committee and probably
more so the budget committee who this
this particular
goound. So, I would strongly encourage
you uh perhaps when you have a fuller
board, but you really should get wrap
your head around the idea of certifying
the plan and making amendments as
necessary going forward for the next
period of
time. So, there's that first part. The
second part is when you read these bills
and I would bring your attention to the
section. Excuse me, Dick. Before you go
on that, the certification process, is
that a public hearing or I think it's a
public hearing and it says, "Yeah, we're
good." I mean, yeah. So, a public
process in Yeah. Carol,
yeah, Carol could fill in on that. So,
um I mean, it's not I think it's a
public hearing with very little more
than notice and a motion and a second
and that's
it. Uh so, the part housing fighting the
housing prices by cutting red tape
regulations to encourage responsible
construction more
housing. Uh there's more bills than
this. I am on the housing committee. I
can tell you that there are probably
closer
to 50 bills which will likely pass.
uh the impact effectively. It impacts
zoning and
planning and many of the things that we
accept as normal or are in our zoning
and when I say normal things that have
been in our zoning and most town zoning
for decades
uh will simply be removed by an act of
law. I'll give you a simple example. One
is
um a requirement that allows you to have
requires um a town can say you have to
have at least two parking spaces per
dwelling unit. Well, they're going to
change that to one. That's a significant
change. It's they're going to they're
looking at some of the one of the bills
deals with mixed mixed use housing. So
we sit down here on the common in Troy
and there is in fact less than one
parking unit park there's in fact less
than one parking space per housing unit
on this
comp which is a bit of a
problem.
Um, and right now if you came to the
planning board and said, "I want to
build a house, a property here," you
would have a problem getting it
approved. You'd have to at the very
least have to go for a variance. Well,
if this stuff passes as
it's if this passes as it has been
written and it's coming out of
committee, it is highly likely that it
doesn't matter what you think. This is
how it's going to be.
Um, so the point of the story
is any zoning you you need to wait for
this session of the house and then look
at what zoning changes you need to make.
And most of the laws that are coming
through you will see have an effective
date of one year from the date of
passage. And that keeps in mind the
towns that have to adjust their zoning
and go to town meeting and have and
change their zoning.
But it's a significant these are
genuinely significant changes and I
would think that the planning board
would want
to focus on that for the next 6 months
so that you have your warrants ready to
go into town meeting next year. Uh so
those were the two things I wanted to
talk to you about is number one uh I
think you need to really wrap your head
around just certifying the existing plan
and making spot changes if necessary.
And number two, you need to This is This
is no joke. This came from New Hampshire
the Hampshire Senate Republicans.
However, I can tell you that every one
of these bills had has broad-based
uh bipartisan
support. The the people who were opposed
to them are on both sides of the party.
uh both there the people oppose them are
in both parties and the people that back
them are on both parties. The leadership
of both parties strongly backs this
agenda. I can't honestly say I agree
with 100% of
it. But in the world of real politics, I
can tell you it's going to
pass. A lot of it's going to pass
tomorrow and then the rest of it will
pass in June.
Um, and most of it is going to pass on
what's called the consent agenda. So,
it's not even going to be up for
debate. Uh, it's going to pass in the
first five minutes of the session and
everybody's going to say they're going
to call for approval of the consent
agenda and they're all going to go yay
and it's it's done. So, that's it. I'd
be happy to if you have questions about
any one of the bills, I'd be happy to
answer you tell you what I know about.
Um, but I want I want kind of want to
give you a heads up on that. I wouldn't
spend a lot of time trying to fix
something that's going to
change and relatively quickly. I'll give
you a good example of uh the whole thing
about parking just that's relevant to
us. So, the uh Southwestern Community
Services rebuilt the south they they
tore down some warehouses and slums on
the south end of the common on water
street 20 years ago, 25 years ago. And
there's 15 dwelling units, which means
you need 30 spaces. Well, in those 15
dwelling units, which are prim, they're
age restricted and income restricted.
So, you have a lot of
limited income people over 55.
There are if you go there right now 7
o'clock at night if you count six cars
it's a
lot. Uh but they they are they have 12
parking spaces in addition to the
parking in front of the building. They
have actually got they're entitled to 12
parking spaces at the depot which they
clearly don't need.
Um, by the same token, if you look at 11
Central Square, which is that gray
building over there, it has zero parking
spaces. And what you perceive as the
paved driveway there actually doesn't
belong to that building. It belongs to
the building behind it and the building
to the right of
it. Um, but was done literally done a
100 years ago with a whole different
conception. And in the case of I will
use 11 central square again as an
example. That is two 2200 square foot
apartments. That's a big
apartment. And the zone our current
zoning would not allow that to be
converted into four units.
If these laws pass with the rules on
some of the new rules coming out of from
the state, you would reasonably be able
to convert that into four units. You'd
have four one foot
apartments.
So,
and those are the kind of things that
are happening. So, these are big changes
coming. So, you're going have plenty to
do in terms of adjusting the
warrant, preparing your warrant for
changes to make the zoning fit what
comes out of conquered in the next six
weeks.
Um, but I think that's where you need to
f other than the day-to-day grind of,
you know, looking at plans like I
brought them last week or whatever.
That's the kind of stuff you need to
keep your head wrapped around. So, any
questions for me?
Uh, just follow I was just going to I
apologize for being late, but I was
following on the live stream. So,
I'm just following up on the impact fees
from last week. So, we'd have to have a
certified uh master plan in order to do
those impact. That is our understanding.
And we have to have a CIP and we have
the we have the vestigages of a
CIP. And one of the things that uh and
we discussed the impact fees in the
budget
committee and so you know we can't pick
a number out of the air. At least you're
not supposed to. And it appears that
almost every town that has impact fees
has a different
methodology. But it has to go to So if
we have a
$1,000 impact fee per unit, uh we have
to say of that 200 goes to the fire
department, 200 goes to the, you know,
parks, recreation, whatever we're doing
with it. And but there has to be a CIP
in place for that. So and Ben Ben Drug
in the budget committee meeting I
thought made a very good point. Uh he
said the impact fees made actually make
a lot of sense because if you're going
to build a bunch of new buildings and
change the operating structure of the
town, you know, what's here we already
paid for and built without you. So it's
kind of a matter of chipping in to cover
the cost that we were already all born.
Yeah.
And I really never thought of it quite
that way, but that's what it really
comes down to.
So, anything else?
Good. Well, I thank you all for
listening to me and I wish you a quick
and interesting
meeting more. But if you have to choose
between the two, go for quick. Sometimes
interesting is nuts. There's no way
where you really want to go. Thanks a
lot. Thanks.
So I will say we're looking at having to
make zoning changes based on
um state
law unlike last year. We
should start earlier,
but we don't know what's going to go on
yet. We have to wait this next week.
Yes, absolutely. Start earlier so we can
actually get one thing we learn about
these
changes planning and
not coming up in December and saying,
"Well, what changed?"
Yeah. This is only some I don't see them
or us being able to cut
I mean, some of them it's really not a
cost to it, but the other ones there
are. There's like probably four of them
that I saw earlier today when I was
going over
it. I know water uh the water sewer
facility. That one was one of them.
There was one for driveway
permits. Um speeding up the process or
something like that.
SP 153 expediting the process for
approving driveway permits. So that's
going to take away from the current
projects that they currently have to out
and do a driveway inspection. And I
don't think we have an issue of taking
very long doing ours um in in the first
place. I think John is actually on point
with doing our driveway inspections,
but if we get more building and
everything and happen to do work right
away.
Um, there are a few of them though, just
to be aware. That's good info to
have
received April
um, Southwest Commission Commission
highlight anywhere.
You guys got sent three of them.
Sure.
I think that might be a dress to give.
Oh, all right.
All righty then. Um any
correspondence? Anything else?
Other than that, I don't see anything.
Wonderful.
um
coming to you send out email for
um I've been I've been getting a lot of
southwestern emails and I just send that
along
other annual
meetingual meeting
on June 3rd social at 5:00 p.m. program
begins at 5:30
p.m. Um I believe that
show.
Okay. Any old
business 2025 work program. Um
spreadsheet like we have
um prioritizing
yeah usually
is Carol on she she is here oh
okay ask
her I come here and I'm just opening up
so I can uh remind myself what we've
been talking
about. Okay, let's see.
Well, a couple of thing. I mean, there's
not really a lot right now that's for
zoning wise that's I think really
burning. I think Dick is right. We need
to wait and see what comes through the
the uh the state house this year. There
is one that that has already passed that
has to do with ADUs, but that's not
going to affect Troy because the the
change is that
um after July, towns will no longer be
able to require a special exception or
conditional use permit for them. It will
be building permit only. But your
ordinance already does that. So you
won't have to do anything regarding
that. Some of these other changes if
they do pass, we will have to have a
look at the zoning for that
definitely. But um you know the other
things I think the biggest thing right
now um is not zoning, it's it's the
master plan. Um to Dick's comments about
reertifying it, that's certainly, you
know, the simplest and the and the
cheapest way to go. And if you're not
going to get money from the budget
committee or the voters, then I guess
that's something that needs to be
thought about. I think realistically, so
you only need to have two sections
legally. It's the vision section and the
land use. The vision I think can be put
together pretty easily from the survey
work that was done. You know that's not
that there only needs to be a couple of
pages if if that you know it's basically
a statement of what what the people want
to see in the future. Updating the land
use plan typically you have a map to do
that. So you're looking at the types of
land uses what they were and whatever it
was 2010 and what they are today. That
would cost money and you're probably not
going to get that money. But it's still
possible I think to do that by just um
you know looking at a map and knowing
what's what's in town, what is happening
where and comparing that to the map that
was done for the last master plan and
updating that. So I think it is doable,
you know, without a huge effort and, you
know, I can participate to some extent
in that and that's not going to break
your budget. So I I think that's
something we should probably think
seriously about.
So you're saying with the budget we
currently have, we can update that map
and Well, not not the map, Curtis. that
the planning commission would have to do
the map and and I'm guessing that that
probably would be in the range of I
don't know some well maybe hundreds and
maybe it's up to a thousand I don't know
um you know it hasn't been updated in in
quite a while. I guess I could ask Henry
that question what it would cost to
update that map but I think that you can
still do it without the map. I mean, it
wouldn't be as accurate, but it's you
can still get a sense of what uses are
going on in town, and you already know
from the zoning map, which hasn't
changed, what is allowed to go where.
And that's really, you know, what you
the biggest thing that you need to know
about your future land use plan is
deciding whether or not you're going to
change your zoning. So, I I do think
it's doable. It wouldn't be, you know,
as robust as the plan you've got now. I
mean, it would it would be, you know, on
the on the sparse side, but it would
meet the legal requirements and it would
allow the say, you know, we have we have
an adopted upto-date required two
sections of the master plan. So you can
go ahead with um you know with your CIP
and and with applying for any grants for
which having a master plan is required.
Oh and including if the selector want to
pursue having an impact fee ordinance
the master plan is required.
I'm interested to see how much that
cost.
Yeah, I agree. I don't know what
everybody else feels. I think if we can
but that would be like a map showing
like what each property currently
used
or they'd be reviewing the zoning
districts uh Carol and making sure that
they made sense relative to to what's
happening now.
Yeah, basically Jack, what you do is,
you know, look at what's going on in in
town, where where the uses are
currently. That's why the map is really
helpful because, you know, you can
visualize it on paper and not have to do
it in your head. And then you decide
whether or not you think that any
changes need to be made to the to the
zoning map, you know, either to expand a
district or for example, we've looked at
the light industrial district and Matt
did a lot of research on that and trying
to decide whether or not that district
makes sense anymore, you know, because
of the way the the lots are. So those
are the the kinds of things that that
you would be making decisions about when
you when you prepare your future land
use plan. And again, you know, it
doesn't have to be doesn't have to be
long, doesn't have to be complicated.
And you might end up saying we don't
propose any changes to the zoning map.
We think that the way the zoning
ordinance is set up now that it works
for us. So that's our plan is to you
know the CIP or impact fees or or grants
or anything else and putting them at
risk and then uh then deciding what we
can pick up. And I agree that the
vision, you know, if the vision's only a
couple of pages and we've got the input
from the survey, you know, why not knock
that off?
you know, for
um for
populating a map, if they would be doing
that with um on the
ground survey or satellite imagery, or
would it be basically just going off of
stuff like the
um tax cards
and existing data already calculated.
Say louder maybe. I don't know if she
heard
you. Carol, do you know for if they're
updating the map if they would be doing
that with like visual
um survey or whatever or just going off
of federated data like we'd have from
the task for you think that sticks Yeah,
Matt, I think these days that's that
back in the dark ages we used to drive
around with colored pencil And that's
how we created the existing land use
map. But I think these days they start
with the assessing data and then the
board has to just prove that and see if
it makes sense. For example, one thing
that I have run into in some towns that
the assessing database will will
classify
um apartments as commercial use because
they're being rented and someone's
making money off of it. So obviously,
you know, an apartment is not is not a
commercial use. So those are the kinds
of things that you have to just keep an
eye out for that, you know, when you
look at that at at the map when it takes
that information and puts it on the map
visually and you see a whole bunch of
red when you know it's not a commercial
use, you know, then then they go back
and make the adjustments. But it is
possible to do it from that, but you
definitely have to have to carefully
proof it.
because their categories aren't
necessarily going to match the
categories that we work with in in
planning. No.
Okay. Thank
you.
Any other discussion on master plan
survey promotion?
No, it sounds like you probably would
pick it up when when Mike and Mike
and back.
Okay.
Um, we already took care of the bill
tracking. Um, anything more on road
safety that you want to touch base
on?
Um, uh, selections update is uh, we're
having our Memorial Day parade on
Monday. You'll be uh, stepping off or
getting ready and lining up at 10:15.
destroy school and be starting at 10:30
doing the normal walk from the school to
the common. From the common there'll be
speeches.
Um it looks like the Civil Air Patrol
will be doing the um 21 gun
salute and
um from there they're going to move
to the down to the
depot and the recck department will be
given uh free hamburgers and hot dogs
for those in attendance. If you're
interested will be reimbursing them.
Um Dylan Gray and Dave Ellis have been
actually working very hard and getting
this done this year. Um so look forward
to seeing everybody out there
and participating and we'll be walking
in it or whatever. Good luck and I'll
see you there. So now our uh the second
next meeting is not until the 29th. We
are not meeting tomorrow.
Um or we didn't meet last week because
we were all out of uh I was on the
military and TJ was out of state. So
next meeting I think is the
29th. Yeah, 29th. So uh that's all I
got. I don't think there's anything
updates
for anything else. No, on the 29th
you're going to be talking about that
traffic flow from Prospect Street and
um a little bit. Yeah, we're having a
hearing about that. Yeah. Yeah.
We got a couple other things going on. I
haven't got the actual agenda yet with
everything's going before I read it, but
we don't have that yet. Jeremy's still
working it. But our big thing right now
that we're focusing on is uh the
Memorial Day parade. So,
Okay. Um, oh, uh, one more thing, sorry.
Um, dog licenses. If you haven't
registered your dog, license your dog
with the town, uh, you will be getting a
letter in the mail and, uh, late fees
and so on and so forth, and the town can
bring you to court, just so you know.
Um, I'll be reading a paper from the
town, uh, the t town clerk, uh, at our
next meeting, getting more detail, but
after our June 1st or our June meeting.
It's going to take effect and the select
are going to be voting on it. So, we had
over 200 people or 200 dogs that weren't
licensed. Uh I think it's down closer to
like 130 now that are not licensed, but
there's people coming in throughout the
day and doing it. So, hopefully uh we
can get 100%. That'll be a first time in
a long time or ever. First time ever.
So, register your dogs, please. It's
actually state law.
Um not expecting any
nonpublic our next meeting
um June
4th.
Um
here and that I'll entertain a motion to
adjourn.
I'll second that motion. You got to make
a motion first. He says he'll entertain
one. So, so the chair, just so you know,
the chair usually doesn't make the
motion. I'll make the motion to adjourn.
I second. There you go.
All in favor?
I have
738. I'm sorry.
Not our fastest meeting, but it's