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Capital Improvement Plan Advisory Committee

Video

I've just got drumming the chair.
As normal, we're going to go around the room here and introduce ourselves.
Agenda review.
Have any changes we want to make?
I'm going to delete the spreadsheet.
Any detail work?
Sorry.
That's easy.
Anything else?
Okay, let's start with, what do we want to start with the presentation?
Do we want to go in order of what we saw?
Do I want to go in order how the spreadsheet runs?
Let's sort of play a trigger.
Your call.
I guess I'd like to go the way the spreadsheet runs.
Town Buildings is the start, and again, I'm going to cut that
because we have a subcommittee that's starting up in a couple.
At the end of September, it's going to start up,
and we're going to see how far we can get with that.
Fire, I know Peter's safety doesn't have anything in detail.
One thing I do want to remind everybody is that just to maintain the CIP,
for the different CRS, you know, we have fire vehicles, ancillary equipment, and the dry hydrants.
Just to maintain status quo, we need to add just on $85,817 to fire vehicles,
19,250 to ancillary equipment, and $400 to dry hydrants, just to maintain status quo.
Current balance is somewhere in the neighborhood of $550,000.
I'm not going to try and figure out. I looked at so many different balances and they're all plus or minus 20% from my book. So I don't know what the balances are.
I'm going about what I was given by finance on July 7th. So just as a mind, we need about $100,000 added to that just to maintain.
So we're looking at one engine one needs to be replaced within the next few years, most likely for $500,000, not a white
the count out. And then the 2008 rescue pumper has less than 10 years left than it, by my guess.
So the fire vehicle fund has been shortchanged for a number of years.
Right. And despite the $3 million request last year, the previous years, like nothing was put into it.
So I think that we need to be making a recommendation to put into the fire vehicle.
The question I have, because I don't have the spreadsheets up, I'm looking at the balance for ancillary equipment.
And the estimate that Peter had for his ancillary is basically repurchasing the airpacks, when that needs to be done.
And there's almost, there's 80 there now.
And his, he had gotten a quote directly from the company that they purchased them from originally when it's,
was worked in the thing, what the face came in last year with a totally blown out of
the sky estimate on what it would be to replace, which was not accurate. I would, I think we
should, is that 20,000 is based off the last year's number, and that's not accurate. So I'm
wondering if we should just revisit that, but look toward putting, you know, putting a chunk
of change into the fire truck fund. And then hold off on the end.
ancillary because that's not something that needs to happen like this second.
There's a, I can't remember the time frame, and I'd rather verify that with him, unless Kevin knows when they're due to be replaced.
Yeah. I have 20131 in the spreadsheet. Yeah, and his estimate, if I remember correctly,
it was 160 that the company said to replace what needed to be replaced when that happens.
Okay. And last year we were told.
something, it was like 225 or something, and that's, that's not accurate.
So we need to put something in that I would say yes, but I don't want to be throwing out a number
when we don't have an accurate understanding of what it's actually going to cost and what
actually needs to replace something. Because I think it's the bottles, right?
The bottles, the bottles got to be recertified, and if they fail, after 10 years, then we've got to replace
those. Right. But that's not necessarily all of them at the same time. That's the other thing.
So we're not looking at 160 out the door at one time.
We're looking at whatever bottles need to be done on a rotating basis when they come up for a certain.
Understanding that if they get to 10 years, you want to be replacing them.
But I don't know what the cycle has been, whether they were all replaced together at the same time on this last purchase
or whether it's been a bottle here, a bottle there.
You're a bottle there, a bottle?
Yeah, no, it's...
Probably a roller request for once myself.
Yeah, it was all the package unit that we had with the hannis.
And the hannises are all good, batteries are all good.
We just had them checked out by a certified airpack person.
Mm-hmm.
And it's just the bottles that's going to be needed to be hydro-testing.
And if they fail,
If they fail, then we have to purchase models.
And the hydrotesting will come out of the maintenance budget general fund.
Yes.
It just to replace it will come out of hands later.
How old do they, when were they purchased?
It's been probably the biggest issue we had is the teletric system.
Yep.
That was with the airbag.
So that means that the command,
who have was in command, has a computer,
and can watch each and every person how much they have,
how much they think they can go on,
and they can recall them right from that computer.
The problem is now the computer was taken away
and they're either thrown up or give it back.
So that program is no longer with us.
So we don't have which ability to download that program?
Peters in negotiation would
MSA to
MSA who has a
yeah to
get the program
we just need the computer
so it's the hold of
is the fact that nobody
knows where the computer went
no but it's slated for replacing
in what did you say 2031
so we had to do everything it would be 2030
it's assuming of 15 year life
yes so 15 years
minus 31 is
somewhere around you fluctuates but
Well, it's, we have
five
what you had to switch now
because roughly 30 minutes of there,
give or take, and then you're going to switch out to bottles,
so we always have, you always have more
where you have.
What's the price, do you know with the cost of bottles, just off the top
of your head, do you know with the cost of one of the
bottles, roughly?
$160,000,000.
Well, that was for the whole thing. That was for harnesses,
software, the system
and that also locates people, right?
Yes. So that you're in a building it locates where you are as well.
So that's everything.
I work.
Rough estimate, maybe
$1,200 bucks.
Okay.
Maybe $15.
Okay.
Once we get the computer,
if you're going to bring it down to LSA program.
No, if it's actually a town hall or...
Nobody knows where it is.
Sorry, either threw it out,
gave it away, took it home.
It's AWOL.
Are you open?
Another computer, right?
Yes.
In 19,000 away now, that's, in five years when they were replaced, that's $100,000 added on, so it's $80,000 that we recommend $15,000 for the ancillary equipment, CRF, honestly.
Do you're a second or not?
I'll second.
Was there anything done on the five vehicles yet?
We need to have a discussion on this now, first.
Okay.
Oh, a second. Because we think that the 19 is based on an estimated cost to a quarter.
Which is not accurate. Which is not accurate. That was, he was over, that was a, that was pulled out of orifice.
Right.
Because I verified that. It wasn't accurate. So I, until we know what we're looking at.
And we just need to replace the bottles?
Well, I mean, theoretically.
We still not really know exactly what we're replacing.
We don't.
But at least if a bottle fails, 10 bottles of a fail right now, you know, we've way more than enough to do that.
I would rather put something in it than nothing.
And I think we're more likely to get the okay to have it put on a warrant article for 15 and more likely that the public actually will say, hey, we'll get you 15.
It's like a psychological number, you know, as opposed to 19 something.
Yeah.
But if, you know, if they want to play with that, they want to up it or lower it, at least we're putting something in it.
and when they have time to reassess everything, there's still time to make the amendment down the road, too.
Or to go to the select board and say, hey, look, CIP recommended 15, but in the last two months, we've got more information, and that's a good number, or, you know, maybe we do need more, or even do it in, you know, deliberative.
So it can be tweaked either way.
Right.
Yeah, I mean, I mean, I think we could set up and be too.
Yeah, I could let Peter get on the speed.
Okay.
Any other discussion.
All in favor?
All in favor?
All in favor?
All right.
I do you, against?
Hearing none is 5-0.
Back up just in a minute.
Stephanie, do you know what is required
for the computer?
Peter, he said just...
Price, that's going to get empty
as soon as we replace the truck.
Yeah, so
I think that's...
Close to 100,000 just to maintain it.
85?
Yeah, I...
We make a motion for 85?
Okay.
Second.
I'll second.
Those.
Scott, you said the engine one
is we replaced
in the next few years.
Is that
one year?
Is that two years?
Three years?
It depends who you talk to.
Kevin can't answer
it's better than I can, but
as I understand it.
Engine
1 is a 1994 model.
It's what was a lifetime
as 20 years.
We're basically.
Basically, the bottom line is that
one of the things that was not discussed last year
what was not watching the table
was that there is
annual maintenance, annual testing that's done
on these vehicles. So there was a lot of
nonsense reported that vehicles weren't taking care of
the tires that were put on it, blah, blah, blah.
No. The pump was redone. Different
things have been redone on it.
None of the proper testing
was done last fall. It was supposed
to be, that's being handled again now.
If tires heat
changed, they're changed. If it, you know,
It has to go through certification, and there
are a lot of things that have been redone with
it, and it's a truck that everybody
likes because the pump is on
the front of it,
and so it's easier to get into places, because
you're not taking up a whole space.
And the methodology
has always been, get, just like
the highway, get as much as you can
out of it, as long as it's running,
and you replace it when you have to,
while still keeping in mind
that when it drops
dead, we need to replace it.
the,
the, what we were told last year about,
what was it, 10, 15 years,
the standard, that was absolute fabrication.
NFPA came out with a, what do they say,
25 now?
25.
25, because departments can't,
people can't afford it.
So, I mean, NFPA is even saying
it's maintained, and depending upon your call
volume, if you're in Rochester,
you're going to get 25 years out of it.
So, if we're looking at that 20, 25 year
thing, yeah, it's a,
the truck's older than my kid.
But,
Well, we also asked last year to
give some idea
what kind of condition that was in,
my image, stuff like that.
Right. I'd like to get a complete
report on it.
Is it certified now?
Can it be certified if it's not?
And even after getting certified,
what's its expected lifetime
based on its current condition?
Is that, are they starting to get
the brush spots in the frame?
You know, is it, you know, things like the major problems,
is the engine still running really well,
or it's got X hours on it, and it's not going to last five years?
I don't know.
It's just major issues, like the highway trucks.
Right.
Is it going to last run on it?
And then that's where, like I said, that was,
all the appointments have been made prior to Peter leaving,
those were all canceled,
none of that stuff was done with any of these vehicles.
It got pushed off almost a year,
and they're playing catch up with that now.
So I guess it's just a matter of when that's,
stuff comes in, then...
Inspections.
Well, the basic inspection was done
by somebody wasn't certified to do them.
They didn't do any actual overhaul,
the testing and the servicing that's supposed to be done.
It was put off
because they wanted to blow the budget on another thing.
So that puts it almost a year behind.
And then some issues came up
because of it because they didn't do that.
And then there was a little issue with, like,
that was a computer with the transmission on one of them,
and there was another little issue.
you that it could all have been prevented, but at the end of the day, it's going to be,
I don't know when they're scheduled, or if they've been done, but those reports, once those come in,
I guess we just, you know, have to make sure that we get those, and then again, we still have time to amend this.
Right, right.
With that information.
Right.
I would also, personally like to know, like the highway trucks and, like the, like the greater in the highway department,
you can't get parts for it anymore.
It's running now, but when that,
part fails, it's dead.
And that can happen tomorrow and next week or five years from now.
And that's exactly fine.
So we need to have, but I'm also hearing that it takes two years to get a truck after you
order it.
If you order it new, now the thing that thing is is, like, the engine, that engine and the ladder,
and correct remember I'm wrong, were demos.
Right.
So, and that's the, that's the thing is that you, if people know what they're doing and put the feelers out with the,
and we were handed, you know, print out this is the truck.
I like, here you go.
There was no call around.
And when you have the relationship with the vendors and go, hey, you see a demo that comes up that meets these criteria
and you know that it's coming up the next six months or the next year.
Now is the time to be going, hey, can we get that demo in the next year?
Or, you know, without, and when it comes in, then you pay for it.
Like, that's the kind of stuff that has been happening with the fire department.
And I would assume that that's going to continue.
The other thing that they were looking at was the,
Because the tank size is a problem and still looking at, I don't know if they're, they're okay for departments.
I know ATF is using them, but the, the smaller, yes, that.
Yeah, the high-resher system is a truck, so that's, that's a little bit less.
It's a package that fits right on like a 550 pickup truck.
Mm-hmm.
Chassing. So, and it carries five, 500 gallons, which,
The high-pressure system has been proven by the APF that you use less water and put out more fire.
So with the size of the truck, it's beneficial for us.
Some of the driveways, you have a very hard time getting in.
Yeah, the driveways.
Whether we're going down or we're going up.
In getting out.
So this would definitely be beneficial for us.
We were thinking about getting a quote for that.
two years ago, which was less than $300,000.
And is that just, is that for the whole, is that included $5.50 or just a...
That, everything.
It's driving it in.
So would that replace engine one or does engine one have a feature that feature instead of that doesn't have?
It would be...
Or is it another trouble?
Anon.
about it.
And NG1 is, in a lot of departments around, laughed about it, is basically a, is basically a plastic body.
Right.
I understand.
Which is not, you know.
But there's a rust.
Nope.
Keeping the maintenance up on it, it's a commercial vehicle.
It's a commercial chast.
So parts are on high-to-find.
They're readily available.
The biggest thing that everybody likes, Alton likes,
Bondenstead's used us quite a bit of times, quite a bit of times.
For instruction, we can drive down a boat rear, put on a hose, and pump for days to all the trucks.
So that's the big benefit of it.
You have a lot on the nose as well as on the side?
Yep.
for filling out.
So we can go...
You know, rural hitchcoes forever.
Yep.
And redirect.
I mean, we have
come a long ways
in supply, water
to a scene.
Which biggest issue right here?
Of course.
That's what we're...
And especially in drought where...
You're going to drought in...
What's E2?
E2?
It's a rescue truck.
It's a furrow.
It's a custom.
What is it?
The 1,000-gallon tank on that.
An engine one that's how big?
1,000 gallon on that.
Okay.
So there's, so what are the same?
Yeah.
Okay.
Biggest problem is if you go any bigger on the floor here,
you're going to break up the floor.
That was by the 2000.
Right.
Because you're adding what?
I mean, the figure it was like 8,000 extra pounds for 1,000 gallons of water.
Right.
So, right, that's what they were recommending last year to replace the pumper with just
of just a water tank truck
which
I didn't see the logic in
and to these 2,000 gallons
it's got a real inflow.
So.
And with a 2,000 gallon truck,
you're not driving that down a driveway
the freaking link. That's not happening.
Right. So
the question is, you're not going to get it up
half, halfway through
I'm going to show a road.
So if E2 needed to be replaced,
what would that, would replace?
What would replace?
truck have to
have to have it?
You don't have to get a custom
made
because you're going to have
a thousand gallons of water.
That also has
50
yeah, it's got 50
50 gallons of foam
on it, plus it has
the rescue tools on it.
Right.
That's in 2008?
Yes.
Okay, so we're looking at,
we're still looking at,
we're still looking at,
down the road on that as long as
as it's maintained and functioning.
That's, I think I just
just, what are the courts on that?
What are it's on that?
They're pretty common.
They're still pretty common, so.
Because you said the company doesn't make it anymore.
Yeah.
So it's not.
Well, the company doesn't in the truck anymore
with the parts, it's real.
Parts, yeah.
I mean, it's not like ordering
greater parts in Turkey.
Right.
Yeah, it's a Cummings engine, so
it's an Allison transmission,
which they,
Rochester truck had the module
right in stock, so.
Okay.
So you're looking at the possibility
getting a truck that does not
additional truck that just not
replace even on that 550
with the high pressure system, would replace one of those
two trucks. Oh, absolutely.
It would have to. So it would have to be, so
what else could be? So
if you had that high pressure system,
could you put that high pressure system, could you put that
high pressure system on
some type of chassis, maybe it's not a 550,
but could be put in something else,
but you could have the capacity for whatever rescue stuff
you needed to put on there, like, what would you,
could you put that on a truck and replace
the 2008 if you had to with that
high pressure system?
We could actually,
we actually
just played with
specs. We could put
battery
operated
rescue
equipment on it,
the jaws, the cutters,
everything. On that truck,
on that 550,
without a problem.
The only thing it would not
probably have is
a 24 foot
essentially. Everything else
it could be done. It's just a mini-pumper
is what it is. So it could theoretically
you could set it up to
do what the
2008 does
on a smaller scale, but the 500
gallons of water because the high pressure, what would that estimate? Is that, is it double what you'd
normally get with a regular? 500 high pressure, what is that equivalent to on a regular
a regular 1,000 gallon tank? Like, how is that compared in terms of? Probably about
3,000 gallons. So it's way over? Yeah. So the 500 blows away the 1,000 gallon tank. And that's like, that was like that was like when it was first explained. So
it almost makes sense to
if that's something that works
and it's
versatile
for all the places that we need to get to
plus the other towns that we respond to
and we can
put rescue stuff on it
and
the water is a killer to kill
the seal. It's different. Everything around to any kind of fire
around. Smaller truck, which means you don't
eat people with CDLs
for non-mergencies.
Run your roads. So
I mean, it almost
it kind of makes
sense to look at that as
the replacement
when
that one
has replaced.
Right.
Has the event.
You might like to see a
anything like that?
Is the technology
with now well established?
Yes. It's in use.
Yep.
It's in using.
Is it? Is it?
Still was very mad the last time I heard
Pete talk about it. Yeah. And I know the ATF.
The Fire Academy, are they using it too?
They want to see one of the
pumpers in Peter's
taco company
to bring
actually has brought
to the Fire Academy
but all the young
kids like to see the big red drugs
not the small little drugs at.
Well it's like I went to support the PD
because they'd leather jackets. That's what you wanted to
want to wear a leather jacket
and one with Cortex. So I get it.
Right, yeah. But you know, at the end of the day
people also wanted to hang off the
of a truck and that stopped being allowed
when, you know, sometimes, what, the 70s
or something now? So it's not
what we want, it's what we need.
Right. So.
It's getting more and more common.
Becoming more common now for those
high pressures because
you can have one or two guys.
Mm-hmm.
One guy can actually take that truck.
Set it all out.
Grab, grab the hose and go
in. Two and two out.
Mm-hmm. That's right.
But essentially,
The way personnel, trying to find personnel, is that truck could be run by one person and put a fire row.
Fully involved.
How does that, the way the thing, the system work is you have this long pole.
Like a giant notes.
Yeah.
But it's steel or something, right?
It's hard.
No.
How do you get on the walls?
Oh.
The pierce, no.
You go.
through the door.
Okay.
Or you go through the window.
Okay. His previous, Peter described it as
the steel rod that you just
saw a jammed in the wall.
We do have,
we do have that.
That's accessory.
Yeah, that's an accessory.
We actually have that.
We used to accessory. It's
like that. We could poke a hole through the wall
and use that system.
Enough of high pressure for it.
Would we get
under condition of the trucks, I mean
what the, the, yeah, estimated
remaining lifetimes.
Right.
Mileage.
The mileage isn't...
It's the hours
on the pump, and mileage
isn't the issue. It's the condition of
all the pumps and
the working components.
So, mileage is not an issue because they don't
give... They don't... They don't...
They sit. You drive them and they sit.
But it's the moving parts within
the truck, and
and that comes down to
when they're tested, you know, when they're tested,
certified and...
But so the high pressure
is FPA approved
for, like, could a town
in New Hampshire right now go by it and be no issue?
We should be able to, yes.
We should be, okay, so we...
N. F.A. is actually
fighting because
they're...
I hate to...
I'd say it's
the big companies,
Greenwoods, the
Sparrows and all that.
they input their money into
N.P.A.
Okay. And they go, okay, you've got to buy
big better, you know, life-borne trucks.
They're not too sure about
approving the
high-pressure system.
But it's not something that would preclude us
for doing it?
No. Okay.
Why?
We would still have our
qualified
program.
Certified or...
Yep. The pubs get certified every year.
Oh, yes.
They were scheduled.
Yes, they were.
And that would give kind of an idea.
Yeah, we have that now
that had been done when it was supposed to be done last fall.
Yep.
We are in contact
with the company to come up.
So the company can come out and do it because they do it on site.
Yep.
They'll go up to much porn.
Unfortunately, they have to do it, you know,
just like everybody else, you've got to get in the line
because it wasn't.
But hopefully that information
could potentially be available before
final decisions are made
before
delivered session
all that. There's a suggestion, $85,000
on. The motion is $85,000.
Yeah, we're stood out.
Anything, it's been a couple
of, it's been at least
through or not three years. I think that
that might have been one of the other
things, but if I remember
correctly, the Board of Seleckman
did not put anything on the Warren
article two years ago,
and last year
it got voted down.
I don't, I can't remember what, I can't remember
what my research was for the year before that,
but you make that motion
first. Yeah.
I'll second. I think
I already did that. Any other discussion of the motion?
Hearing on all in all in favor?
Aye.
Aye. Aye. Any opposed?
You know, drug hydrants is kind of a boring thing.
Is 18,000 or so
in there now.
When was the last time they didn't was used for that?
Because I think that they were doing them as they did.
But which one was best?
Dry hydrants.
Yeah.
My balance is 13,000.
thousand, call it 600.
Yeah, but I don't remember
when the last time they pulled money out of it.
That's what, that was what I was kind of looking at.
I'm going to guess.
Davis, Bill Culbert,
does it draw higher than there?
That's one of the last, if not the last one.
That was...
But the questions, did they pull it out?
10 years ago.
Okay, something like that. Yeah.
It depends on the big the culvert is.
You know, just
six-inch culvert, obviously
they don't do that. But when they do the huge
those huge,
huge box culverts that cost 500 grand or whatever the silly prices are.
That's the time to put in a dryer.
Great. I remember that Will it said something about that.
I'm looking back, so I don't see, well, I'm looking at 20,
I'm looking back to the balance of January 2025.
Yeah.
And nothing was spent out of it last year.
I don't have the spreadsheet for anything before.
My last estimate it was $8,000 to $8,000.
I was going to go and gold.
price of material or stuff like that, it won't surprise.
But we barely have enough of one right.
We have to have some kind of water source.
Yeah.
It's just a stream of something and then you create a giant bucket
in the ground to hold that water.
Yeah.
We usually talk with that's the...
Do we have no idea what might...
I think we have, large culverts, we did what we did
on South Shore Road, a year or two ago.
Colbert, they think a big culvert on the South Shore Road.
They did. They did do a big culvert, but I don't think there was a vehicle
water source.
Okay, so that would be my thing.
It's like, okay, do we know where there's one that might need,
like, do we have any info on that or we just, we're waiting in it?
Yeah, no.
Just thinking of driving up around the roads.
North, Ridge Road and Berry roads are all dry.
If not, any, they have no dry hydrants on them.
I wish there was, because there's no water-shortening or near there.
A whole half a pound.
You need high pressure system.
You, right.
I make a motion to recommend 500.
I don't see that anything was added at least in the last two years,
so I don't remember the last time money has even added to it.
No, it happened, no.
I think I'd like to modify that as zero to it.
$500 is a pill, is...
So you...
I'd like to modify that to $5,000.
$500 is in the same time we have to look at what would be some real to you can.
Yeah, I know.
Just like for the highway to.
Yeah, I know.
But what would that up to, Christian?
A couple million dollars.
Yeah.
$2 million if everything...
Yeah.
So...
Which knows, I mean, never happen.
I mean, the thing is, and the problem is that we need to add that money in there because it hasn't been done.
But if we even try, it's $2 million just a...
But I would draw my...
motion for $500, and I'll make an additional, a new motion for $1,000.
Can I do that?
All right.
Yeah.
I think I can, can I? Can I?
If I withdraw it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, all right.
Because I can take that out of the table, right?
Yep.
Any other discussion on a motion?
Well, I need a second.
My thought of the process would be is that it's kind of splitting the baby with the bathwater kind of thing.
Like, I think 5,000 to try and talk people into that, they're not going to understand.
We don't know any information.
I do agree with it.
is tiny if something needs to replace, but 1,000 at least is putting something in it so that
if we're looking at 15 grand, then we're in the ballpark of funding one if that comes up,
and it's one of the bigger ones.
Yeah.
It's more palatable, I think.
Yeah.
And it's not, also not knowing when it might come up.
Great.
And it may not.
So you say, you know.
Right.
No idea.
We're going to close with 10 years ago.
The launch of it makes sense.
Any other discussion on that, we're in all in favor.
Okay.
So that's hard part.
So that's 101 for all that DISA.
5.1, 101, yes.
The town hall, were we going to completely let that go and not throw anything into that?
Is that what the thought process is?
I think that's, we have no idea where we want to, where the subcommittee wants to go.
We are going to start meeting on September 30.
Like this report should be done later.
I think we're just going to kind of table that for a year and come back with a full plan.
That's what I really want to do.
An idea if you look at the town buildings, CRF, to maintain it, is $57,000.
It is about $68,000.
Town building improvements, is it $68?
That's what I have.
Where did they spend out of it?
I have no idea.
That's what I have.
What applies to the town building?
The library boiler?
No.
The town hall.
Could we did the food with that last night?
Last night.
What's the cost on that?
$25,000.
That's helpful to know.
How did that end up on the thing that we didn't find out about that?
When did that boil?
Where did that information come up?
I didn't know it was even an issue.
We've been discussing all this and nobody said anything about that.
No.
I didn't know the boiler was even injured.
Tail ailing.
I thought it was fine.
And are we doing propians?
because that's a nightmare.
Is it propane?
Yes.
We lost our shirt on that.
They should never have gone propane over it.
DPW.
Biggest waste of money and propane's through the roof,
and we've made a huge mistake on that.
So we're putting 25,000 that includes,
because that's not propane now over there, is it, it's oil.
So we've got to get rid of that tank.
That's $2,000 to $5,000 in agreement with the tank.
Yep.
That includes a good thing.
That includes really good tanks.
That includes a tank.
the install on all the propane tanks?
That's everything.
Where's the oil?
It's been moving all of oil.
It's stuff with oil.
And I don't know what it is.
Because that was the other issue is where they placed the propane tank.
They could put it on the back.
And they talked about not in the car sclors.
There were a few people that said that propane is less of oil.
You can go through it faster.
Look at the bills this year.
It's been awful.
I asked that question.
I said, how does a gallon of propane compare with the gallon of oil?
nobody had a good answer. I don't know.
And W is a perfect example.
That should never have gone in that building because it's a wide-open
building and that thing is just to keep it
at a, and just to get to the point
where you're heating up that office space,
plus you've got to keep the trucks all winter
long. I don't know.
Well, I know how that happened. It was
a knee jerk. Somebody just said, let's do it
and make it propane. That was never discussed.
It was never vetted out.
And that was a disaster. And
we are screwed with
fuels here. From budget standpoint.
screw. And this building here,
because nobody
turned stuff down, the Pee blew
through propane like crazy. Like,
everybody has talked to said the dumbest thing in the world was
to have gone propane furnaces for the stone.
And
it's unfortunate, but
156, 942.
But that was
as of, and I had
6,800 transfer.
I don't know what that was. And I don't
know when it actually happened.
So there was a purchase, and that at some point
trustees and trust funds waved their magic wand
and it looks like that was taken out,
but I don't know what it's for.
I understand there was some other stuff that was going on
with Janelle's door or something recently.
I guess something happened this week, I think,
with the clerk's office?
They did some construction on the inside the window.
Right.
And I don't know if that was covered under the original
9,900 or that came out of something else,
but this was taken before that.
So I don't know with that.
What that cost was, and I don't know where that money's coming from,
how did you get, what was the balance you then?
$68,000. I got this on July 7th from finance.
Did she give you any expenditures?
No.
So that means almost $100,000 was spent since I have this.
That doesn't make any sense to me.
That's what I'm saying.
I don't understand any of these sound numbers.
They're just all over the road depending on the time.
The worst thing it was last year.
So you don't have $100,000 in yours.
So the select board, even though we, yeah, actually, that select board did, they put $100,000 on the warrant article.
Wait a minute, did that get put it down or not?
So my 2025 sheet shows $12.15 of $100,000, $700,000, $77 start, $1,000, $125, 167 was in covered, and, well, he said,
covered, it doesn't look like it was all transferred, it was pending, okay.
pending transfer of 6841 last year that didn't get moved over until this year, which is kind of weird from an accounting standpoint.
So the balance that I had for 1130 of 25 was 145, 422, which then interest going on here, around 150.
I've got to, the numbers don't make sense, but it should be closer to 150.
If the tax is.
vote actually voted. I can't remember. I don't remember that that passed, but it was added on to last year sheet.
Well, if it was added. Oh, wait a minute, I'm sorry, that was 2025, that's okay. So, yes, so 100 was added on December of 2025 from the vote that happened in March of 2025 because it doesn't go into December. So this year, they did not vote, so we don't have anything being added to that. So that. So that, so I understand why my balance is so low.
that would you have I had to say 100,000.
Sorry.
According to this, 156, 944277, with a completed transfer in 2026, it was actually encumbering 2025,
but your balance would be correct if that 100,000 wasn't added to it.
You know what I'm saying?
I'm wondering if that, that might be a, that might be a, a, a scripted error, or it was a, if you got, if you got, if you could you get it from, you curse it?
Yes, so she may, she's still trying to work away, yeah, she's still trying to work her way around some of these things, so we can clarify that.
Yeah, I'm going to have to go back and ask her again.
But I know, I know 100,000 was transferred at the end of the, so we, and there was 77 in it, so that, that, unless somebody spends a ton of money that we don't know about, then, not that that wouldn't surprise me.
All right, all right, so the cost of the propane, the contract ran out last year, last year, the
price went from 199 a gallon to six something, yes.
And we locked in on that, and that's the problem.
So it goes down, we're locked in at six something a gallon because we've locked in on that, and that's my issue.
No, no, we're not.
Are you sure?
Rudy's negotiated a new contract with that and back to $1.99.
I just can't remember if I'm going to $5 million for this.
With the additional equipment that's going to use propane, it may not be enough.
So I just made a note to talk about that contract.
I just wish that before these decisions were made, after all the issues, I've heard nothing good about the propane furnaces.
And I wish that there was some compare and contrast.
Right.
And not just, like, it's almost like, oh, we're just going to go to propane, and there was no discussion about why.
Like, it just happened.
Right.
to get the fuel and there were two options they had somebody in recently to
look at the boiling in the ending and well looked at it decided that it really needs to be replaced
they're putting band-aids on it for too long they said yeah I just they gave an option
for oil and one for propane one for oil was five thousand even in the records here
for it's not last line on once yeah it's not it's not it's not anything that anybody
ever put on being needed
not that I'm not saying that it wasn't but that's been the problem for the last five years of the shamanigans
I don't remember what the last two engineering studies today
I don't know how old the furnace is right but you know the other thing too is that
you can't you know my question would be okay so so a an oil furnace for whatever they
was it one company they came in yeah because they don't have to go out as big it's under 30
so we went with one company we didn't go out to bid him on it so my question is is that yeah
it might be 5,000 more but what's the longevity of the oil as opposed to the gas like in terms of
maintenance in terms of how long it lasts you so it's what work has been done on that and you're
heating and and we know just from this building alone no one seems to know how to turn this
freaking heat off in here it's like people are goldfish oh crank it up so it's 80,000
degrees you know for cribbage and then they leave it that way right and nobody checks
it and the next thing you know we're blown through I mean the did what sounds like we've
got to do some training on conserving if please you know it's gonna be no
it's going to be okay with waste right it sounds like it's raising courtesy right
but the thing it is is is that you know when you what's the efficiency in these bigger
spaces is probably better for a smaller office space like the PD right which
there was they were not right because they hated it when it went to propane there
your town hall is a big open rickety whatever are we you know what's what's more
efficient right is it still a forced out water system that's what the old system
right yeah it's not water water water they can't change you know high air without all kinds
of stuff so it has to be forced not water systems still is it high efficiency
people like from what they were talking to it was like two unit two units two units
Kind of like one would, you know, in the wintertime that they would both run, but off-season.
They call it, they call it a lead-lag system.
Yeah, I don't know that.
That's not.
I think it's kind of leading one line.
Yeah.
Don't you do propane things?
I do.
So why don't you talk to us about that?
Yeah.
What's the lead lag thing?
So the league-leg thing is, so it's too bored of us.
I don't know what they have for hot water up there.
I don't know.
So what happens is one boiler will try to maintain.
The temperature goes down too far.
The other one will kick in is the temperature of surface as it circulates.
Theoretically.
Theoretically.
I can see all sorts of fun with that.
The efficiency is my question.
Is it 96% efficiency?
You know, if it's above 90% efficiency, you know, if it's above 90,
2% of efficiency, it's going to be better, but it's a condescending boiler.
So you can't get rid of that, condensating, acid water, which is you're going to have neutralizer
and stuff like that.
That neutralizer is an, a yearly thing.
You're talking for maintenance on something like that?
For a Lankton Town Hall?
So that, so the decision was made to purchase the Furnace
but we don't know what it's going to cost to maintain it.
And we didn't go to bid because we would just want with one company that gave us a price for oil and program.
It's not big enough to call the slave.
They can't be switched around.
I would think you want to do that every year to get, otherwise you're going to run out
where out of that water.
10 years of a 20-year life and the other one's going to last longer or something like that.
And which would be what additional cost is that to switch around?
In addition to the maintenance switch or something.
Or is it?
It's really not that hard.
Okay, so it's not, or it's making sure somebody actually does it.
Yeah, then no set of it.
Kind of like turning the heat down.
Right.
Well, what smart there is that's not a easy solution?
Six o'clock and they all turn down unless you can push a button to turn it back.
I guess I just don't understand why, you know, it's like you go out the door,
you close the door, like what's so difficult about turning the heat,
turning to tell me.
And here, here's the thing, it was always whoever, whoever,
whoever from the town, whether it's a chair or whether it's a department head that uses this room,
that's their responsibility, not, you know, not someone playing privilege, not someone feeding people,
it's the department head or the chair that's responsible for that.
That, no different to turn it on a recorder.
Like it's, it's not, it's ridiculous that people can't just do that basics
because it amounts to a lot of money.
Yeah, it does.
The end of the day.
The fact is, and it's not everybody, but you're not paying as close to attention to that stuff.
But that's, and that's the point.
It is your money when you're department and your department share.
It's your money and you are the, you're the responsible party for that.
And I think, what was it?
Four, didn't they fill it like four times over?
Was it here or the PD?
There was like a ridiculous amount of fills that went on on one of these buildings.
That has never happened before.
This one idea.
No.
And that's just insane.
Because the, it was not turned down.
not turned down after they had events.
And they had a lot of events.
But couldn't they just put a program a little bit
from that? Where it just
it shuts down to
60 degrees at 10 o'clock at night.
There's an app on my phone. I control my heat from
the kid cut from my phone.
Exactly. I don't know if that's that simple
because of the events that happened.
Right, but the only thing is if the event, I mean,
just say if the event, you know, went until,
you know, say 10 o'clock,
you have a little control of that.
available control that could shut down, you know, at the same time every night and
whatever time you know it, any events that would be able.
Right.
It would certainly be a help.
Yeah.
But they're looking at the times when there's nothing going on in here
and each other.
And then you're looking at actually making sure somebody actually
approves it to have it done, which is, you know,
it's better to watch paint drive.
Right.
So, related question for the, that's for this room.
What about for the rest of the station?
when in previous years, when the station wasn't occupied,
24-7, it was about 95 all the time.
You know, this last year it was occupied
more than 40 hours a week.
In previous years, it wasn't generally occupied
and heat was on during the day?
Or was it only turned on when you got a call?
And it's hard of in hell up there.
Can we even need heat up there?
In the winter time in the office?
No.
there?
Yeah.
What's that?
That is controlled by that thermostat there.
So when they leave it at 68 here?
Oh.
It's eight.
It's only one zone?
What about the rest of the base?
What about the rest of the base?
Two thermostats, because you've got two heaters up there.
I noticed, and Peter noticed,
siding, and when they did the new siding and all that,
they didn't put weather stripping on the garage doors.
That's right.
You can literally see it on time.
That's brilliant.
I never saw Bill on that.
Where did that come out of?
That came out of a building.
That came out of a building.
I can't be a little bit of this town in that.
Did that come out of the CRF?
Something.
Because there were some fast news going out because they...
Something was...
...donated.
It's like, or is the work...
There were a bunch of workers here, so I'm curious about that.
I think they did the work for free.
But we don't know.
Because I've never gotten an answer on that.
I forget.
They did ask about it.
Because the other thing, too, is it worked for free where they
did with insured, where they clearly didn't know what they're doing.
And this is where we end up with these issues
and no checks and balances.
Oh, you saved so much money.
Well, we didn't.
I know.
And I'm wondering if that was a 68-40-
And you put a band-aid on a problem.
Right.
I don't know if the society would have been approved.
If that came out of, because if that,
I'm trying to figure with it, like, that's an odd number
to pull out of that CRF.
So that happens.
to be approved by the select board in order to pull that out of there.
Right.
So, but it wasn't anything that was budgeted for.
Building improvement, ETF, that cannot be approved by the town administrator.
That has to be approved by the board of selectmen in order to actually expend it,
and then the trustee of the trust fund to make the actual transfer, which they'll do,
as long as they verify that it fits the criteria in the Warren article, but there's no,
the TA would have no ability to authorize that.
If that was, if that was what it found, and my understanding was,
that something got pulled out of that, that ETF.
It's not just the amount that makes a difference.
No, any CRF or ETF, because there are a warrant article,
can only be approved by the Board of Selectmen for that expenditure.
Okay.
So T.A only approves for the budget?
T.A.
No, T.A only approves for the budget if it's an un...
You guys just read your purchase policy.
So there's a certain...
amount of money up to $30,000, I think, as long as it's budgeted.
So the T.A. can only approve, if it's unbudgeted, it has to go in front of the board of
selectmen. It can't be approved by the T.A. If it is over, I can't remember when it's over.
The department has up to a certain amount, and then I don't know why they extended it so much,
because I don't think any T.A. should have that authority to spend up to $30,000 out of a line.
But the T.A. can approve, with POs and stuff can approve up to like $30,000, as long as it's a budgeted
expense. If it's not budgeted, it has to go to the select board. And that's not been happening
at all. So they changed up to 30. Unless you guys moved it back the last time you did the
purchase policy. I don't remember seeing the new purchase policy, but it was up to 30 grand.
That's how all that shit got purchased over here, right? Which it wasn't supposed to because
it was unbudgeted. So regardless, if it's in the budget, so for instance, we're going to
to go by $30,000 of gravel. It's budgeted. We've got a contract with it. The TA can go,
yeah, it's going to this, we've already got that schedule. They're allowed to do that. That's
really what it was for. But if it's not in the general budget, it was not approved by the budget
committee and submitted that prior year for that year, no expenditure, no matter how small,
can be done without the approval of the like for.
So even a $1,500 purchase cannot be done on budgeted unless the select board approves it.
But with the ETS, so the CRFs, it has to go through the, no matter what the amount is,
it has to go through the select board for that basic approval.
And I don't know if the, I don't know about this, like the library facility's improvement.
I don't know if that is, I can't remember on the top of the have that, if the libraries have trustees
are the ones who could do that because that's internal.
So that may be one of the only.
those maybe the only two that SLEC board doesn't have the authority over it because they have library trustees.
That was the whole point of keeping it separate from the town projects.
But the facilities is interior stuff, right?
Yeah, and that's why they have that. That's theirs.
So they get to do whatever they want with that.
And again, I can't remember.
But I want to say that the library of trustees have the authorities.
They would have to vote to approve it if the library and wanted it,
and then it would go to the trustee of the trustee of the response, I think, which in my head makes sense because
that's why they have their own internal library facility improvement
because they can do what they want with it.
Right.
Right. Right.
As long as the taxpayers have put the money into that product.
Does anybody have to find out what you did it?
Nope.
The slate per, there's like, the slate per person from here,
nobody, I've never, I've never gotten the invoice with that.
Slate, I don't know.
I don't know what it was.
It was like, no, somebody got some slate from middle grand.
Two grand, four grand, four grand, something like.
that and you're like, oh, slate, where to go?
Yeah, we don't have a slate roof.
We don't have a slate patio.
We don't have any slate flooring.
I don't know if it was slate color, but there was no, I mean,
these are just rubber stamped and shut through.
It's all over the place.
And there were credit card purchases that were split up that weren't supposed to be.
You only go up to, like, I can't remember off the time I had.
It's like maybe up to four grade, maybe on credit card policies.
Specifically said you cannot split it into two.
to fall under that, and that was going on all over the place.
So, you know, that's where, that's what makes all this such a hard sell because so much
was played with that the accountability for every penny is, is why wouldn't the situation
were able that.
Is that with the finance officer quick, because she couldn't deal with, she didn't deal with it later?
The blowback that comes later.
here's the thing is that the finance officer,
they're not responsible for it. Yeah, they are.
Vicki was a finance officer. So if something comes through and it's not,
it's not covered by policy, that's a negative ghostwriter,
Patterns bullet, and you're not getting paid.
So all that stuff that was purchased,
that was not approved, the finance officer has the authority to go,
yeah, I'm not paying it. Because I'm not violating policy.
I'm not violating all this stuff that's going to come back.
and bite me in an audit. Right. Because there was a lot of stuff that has come back in the audit
over the years that he's been a problem. So, you know, and that's where you're like, yeah,
they made me, order me to do it because that's going to be fun. Right. When do we
we audit it last year? Hey, we're audited every year. Right. So when
we, when does all that, all the stuff that happened? What is that, you're getting
audited? They should have, I don't, they should, did the audit any company done by now?
Because usually they're done by end of June, beginning of July, if.
historically.
Now, the draft, however,
historically the last several years,
the Board of Second would withhold those reports
and not approve them
until way later so that technically you can't get a copy, but you can't get a copy, but you can
because once it's suspended in the time because we pay for it, you can't get a copy of it.
So, but
if I remember, most of them were around mid-year, they would
be done, but I don't know where we're at this year.
Okay.
But getting back to the time,
back to the, you know, the town building stuff.
Right.
Like that, I mean, yeah, we need a furnace, we need a furnace.
But this,
I mean, it throws a monkey wrench into,
there's a bazillion dollars worth of stuff that needs to be done.
Right.
And
Should we, based on what you had said earlier,
should we just throw some money into that for
giggles?
Well, now I'm, I'm going to say no.
Yeah.
Because we weren't told that a furnace was needed.
We weren't,
this wasn't, I mean, we've been talking
about this, we've been talking about this, we started
this process in May.
Right. And nobody thought to tell us
that that's what was on the hopper, and then I
find out that we went with one company
because we technically don't have to go to bid,
and I get it. But we went with one
company that went, this is, so I, I'm
going to say no right now. And that's me.
I need somebody else can make a motion, but I'm going to say no now.
The board is like that.
I just found out recently that the
furnace had to be replaced.
And we improved it last.
Okay. So.
very recent.
Just a quick bang bang done.
But was it something like
the death defyifying means to be on today?
Right.
Or is it something that could have allowed?
How much of the first night?
From the guy that came in and inspected
and did some repairs on the boil
and his recommendation was to replace it.
Right. But replace it.
They're all going to say you've got to replace it after a certain age.
The question is, did it need to be done?
Kind of like, you know,
did it need to be done yesterday or
could it have waited for let's assess, you know.
Right.
It's in the middle of summer. Do we need the furnace right now?
Right. I mean, and again,
we looked at DPW last year. That was condemned
and we're at the end of October, we're in October
before it. So, you know, my thing
is that, great, I understand purchase policy-wise
that you don't have to take it to bid unless it's over 30.
But we're talking about a complete
system overhaul where we're going
from oil to gas.
And we get one company to come in with two prices from them
and no one's done the research school, which one's better for this building?
And that is where I have a huge issue.
And that could be the best thing, but we don't know that because it hasn't been asked.
It hasn't been fed it out.
And that's, that drives me nuts because we have wasted so much money on these knee-jerk,
half-assed expenditures, you know, all of a sudden just come out of nowhere.
And yet we kick the can down the road for stuff that we need to do this,
we need to do this, we need to do this.
there's no right or reason and just, yeah, we adhere to the policy, but sometimes it's a good idea
go, okay, what is the best thing for a bucket is, if the oil, is, an oil could be crap, I don't know.
It's 5,000 more, but is that going to get us long?
How long is this furnace going to last?
What's it going to do?
What's it going to be for oil costs as opposed to to propane in terms of that building?
And I guess for me now, my feeling is, yeah, we need the committee to do.
Right.
A good question I have about changing furnaces.
Kevin might have some knowledge on this.
Where the gas is going, I assume we're just going up the existing chimney.
Now, are propane exhaust more or less acidic than oil exhaust, and what's that going to do to the clay lining on the chimney, which I assume is a clay lining on the chimney?
more acidic.
More acidic.
More acidic.
I believe the propane oil is an effect of meant it.
Is it a direct back?
Is it going to stick out the side of the building somewhere?
Yes, that violate the...
historical nature of the building.
Well, that's the other thing.
So we're going to put a hole in the side of the building?
Does Kathy know that?
No, I doubt it.
We don't know that.
I'm not sorry.
She didn't attend to meet him last night.
Unless there's a death of the side,
that means somebody's putting a hole in the side of the building.
Kind of like if you put a dryer in downstairs.
Yeah, it's going to be bigger than that.
Yeah.
It's a four or six inch, right, Kevin.
Four or six.
A little cap thing on it and all that.
Yeah.
Two of them.
Two holes.
Two holes.
Two holes.
It's taken the air from outside.
It's going to be four holes.
Seriously.
Yeah.
Two units.
Oh, in and out.
Okay, gotcha.
Gotcha.
Yeah.
And it may not
have an impact on the historical,
but that's something that...
It's not to be pretty.
Well, it's something
it should be bedded
because it ain't going to be pretty.
And it, you know,
there's a lot of stuff that's not pretty, but
the question
does it do something to the
historical nature of the building
if we're going to spend all this money to side things
and paint it the way it's supposed to be, and then we're sticking
and what do they look like?
Four inch pipe.
Like metal things, jutting out with a hat on top of it?
Some are great plastic.
We'll go out as a...
Yeah, everybody can get a game phone.
It's probably a plastic.
And what...
In a basement?
Like from the basement?
You know, we'll just come out on the side.
The low level, I mean, they have to be of a certain...
Yeah. But we'd come out somewhere on one of the sides.
Right at the sill.
Yeah.
Okay.
Right in the silver.
Then, uh...
They look good.
They look too bad.
I know.
Well, which again, but, you know, like, he needs to bring the point.
It does it...
Historical?
Is it...
Historical?
It doesn't smell?
Or, like, there's a smell of that?
If you walk near it, yeah, there's a smell with it.
But I can guarantee you the firebomb that's going to
hit some calls because you can see
a bunch of steam coming off the side of the building
and people can't think it's on fire.
But as long as it's not, we're good.
But in terms of it, but there is a smell in it.
If you're close enough, there will be a small spot.
Yeah, but if you're taking it in a chimney, it's way clear there.
I'm just, you know, just...
So the oil one must be.
My guess is it won't be a lot of the direct method is forced out.
It's plug up with snow.
Yeah, there goes that way.
Here and take this as of a hat on it.
It's a rain and snow doesn't get in?
Oh, it should have.
It should have a...
It should have...
Where you go upside out.
Kind of like a snow.
Right.
Like that, where it just kind of the air comes into.
Right.
But they took it.
You know, a friend who ended up, her entire system shut down in her house because of that,
and they had to bring her.
the propane company out
to clean everything out because
all the way the snow is kind of going
in your directions and
she's like, oh my God, the house is at 38
degrees, and it was because
that... So when's this
furnace being installed?
I don't know.
Okay. I'll just contact him today.
All right. I'm going to...
A second. A second.
The communication piece needs to be happening.
And it doesn't matter.
And it doesn't matter.
If it's not an emergency,
then there's time to
bring people in the loop on what
needs to be done. This is why
we have these issues, because we have no idea
what's supposed to be done. The information doesn't come.
We're making decisions will and nearly about what to put into
a fund, what not to put it upon. And then
the stuff that needs to be done is put on the
slip, and that's where they have ability to come
back into play where
the committee is going to come into play
in terms of assessing everything, not just
the historical siding in the roof, because that's been
the big put, roof siding. We know we
other things going on there.
But this is going to be a big chunk of change next to your
potential. Yeah. Okay, any of the discussion on the motion?
Very not all in favor? Hi.
Any opposed. So that's that.
Next would be, we go in order is police.
Did you ask for anything? I understand that.
I don't know how much they get from their revolving, new revolving fun.
They're not due for a cruiser for
it really should be three years now. Right. Because
and there is, I got the balance on it,
there is enough to purchase a cruiser now.
Between the two accounts.
Yep, between the two accounts and more than enough
to do what needs to be done. So I make a motion right out of the top
that we don't put anything to that.
Okay. And to talk to Eric, it's like you've not asking for it. So I think that
I'm comfortable with that.
Especially where we have that vehicle that
still doesn't have, we've got a $70,000 vehicle that has no, no, we're supposed to be
depaled as a cruiser. So it's not a cruiser. It's not a cruiser. It's tinted windows that
is just white and it's not a cruiser. And we have three officers right now. One is being used for
details, which is a lot of wear and tear. It does bring money in, but it's six and a half,
one and a half doesn't have the other. And if it will
purchasing cruisers. They need to be look as cruisers, be used as cruisers, and until
that gets squared away.
All they find out is somewhere around 40,000.
There's more than that.
So you have a lot in him with all the details.
Okay. All right.
That started a few years ago, but it's like, it's 20, 30, 30.
That number of?
No, I don't have access to that number.
That's a separate revolving account.
Okay.
requires a separate inquiry. I had it. I just don't, I don't know if I can find it right now.
I don't, I'm not locked into a, I had some pulled up before I got here. I'm not logged into an internet.
So Infinity spent a lot, a lot of time there's somewhere on King's Highway at Pine Point, pulling new lines.
And they had to have another company come in behind and take them all down and pull them all new lines.
They didn't leave enough slack in their lines.
So, and all the time they were up there, there, quite a few days, we had two of our cruisers up there doing these things work.
With no one patrolling.
And then after they, I don't know if they had to do it all over, and now they're up there doing more details.
They're not up there as often as they were the first time.
But they were up there.
I'll second that.
The police, cruiser, police.
It's a cruiser, Sarah.
Do we go to DPW next?
According to Shades.
Yeah.
You want to go somewhere else?
Yeah.
Can we get the little ones out of the way?
Yeah.
Because we have, we don't have much so.
We have parks and rec.
We have library.
We have records, right?
Libraries can't open, I think.
No, no. Library facility is proven.
Well, it's on the same spreadsheet page.
Oh, okay.
I need to rework this whole thing, and I'm going to break everything out.
We do that.
and then, you know, get those smaller ones out of the way, and then...
Right.
Yeah, library facilities.
Rec.
Yep.
All right, well, let's do library facilities that.
How much I don't have the paper.
There's no, if I remember, two, was it two?
The thing that they were requesting is, you know, the furnace was just done,
and then, which actually that comes into the building,
and then, but the carpeting is really,
that was the main thing right and because we like like nice carpeting is not
just a file in my mind but the last few years we had been, I think it was
being requested but I think it was just done right it was done in in 2020 it's not
needed immediately yes we're looking at that account has two thousand is going to go
into it
in December, so it's going to have 10 grand if I did, it's going to have over 10 grand,
well, it's going to have about 10 grand with the interest.
There was a $511 transfer.
So that includes a $511 transfer.
I don't know what that was for.
Okay.
Um, and it could be anything that would be.
Okay.
Now, this is their 2012
request.
Library exterior was last painted in 2017.
That's not right.
Kathy told me last day it was painted.
last year.
That and that's town building.
That's not even under.
I know.
Yeah, so that's a different.
That's a different thing all the government.
You know, well, that's the, that's the problem and that's why these forms and the five seconds
was put on, was put into her suspicions.
She didn't fill them out.
She didn't have her balances.
And that's why department heads need to spend more than 10 minutes doing these because
they're asking for major expenses, whether it's a library fund or the town hall.
So we kicked that.
that back and go, you need that, you're the library, you and your trustees, go figure
out when it was painted, when the roof was done, what the cost was, what that is.
That is their job to do.
And then next year, they can revisit it.
This is where we, this is where we've gotten into a jam with people just throw numbers in it and pop it out.
When you can't take the time to even find out what your balances are, then it needs to go back to the drawing board.
And that's going to be another thing that, like you said, the town hall committee is going to have to work with them as well.
Because that's another potential chunk of change.
But I could have sworn there was, I don't know, it was trim or...
They were saying the windows.
Pillars or whatever.
They were saying the windows won't shut.
They won't open the shut correctly because that's when you go get the pageer back and go fix it.
Which is where we have another problem.
We've had more stuff in town that's happened where the job wasn't done right.
And it's like, well, we got to spend.
money to fix it. No, you bring the people back that are supposed to be insured when you hire them
and say, fix it. And until that happens, you know, that's a cop out for me. So we need to have
riddums replaced because painting does cause them not to, but assess it, come back with something
other than anecdotal, they don't shut because it was painting. CIP proposals.
should be taking a considerable amount of time that they're done correctly.
If they're done correctly, we could justify things and have a much better assessment
to what we really do need to put in these funds, which means every department had needs to do their work on it.
And that is not happening.
Where did she estimate the carpeting or whatever there's seven grand?
And then when is that supposed to happen?
In few years.
It didn't with that.
Well, the thing is, it may not need to be done in seven years.
You know, I mean, it's, it's not.
like we just do it for the sake of doing it.
It was last replaced in 2022.
And that was the only, and they think, they think it could last 10 years.
Let's have that. Yeah, but that's the company, but it doesn't get a distraction.
Chowder drum. So they proposed 10 years.
And there was nothing else. I don't remember her. She didn't submit anything else other than carpet for the inside, right?
She submitted stuff for the other.
Like, sure.
Town Hall, the town hall one.
I make a motion that we do not fund that fund this year.
It's had 2000 in the last couple years, and that's the only chance being requested.
There's 10 grand in there, and so I say, motion burned up.
I'm good enough.
I know, right?
So you could be 100 to three more hours and you're not going to get another kickup?
That's weird.
Okay, good.
Any more discussion on the motion?
Hearing none, all in favor.
Hi.
Hi.
All in favor.
Okay.
Um, we also have...
The booking rack.
Back up as half a step.
Um, records, Tomlin'L Records.
It's in this spreadsheet.
Record.
I didn't think she asked for much of anything, and I think there was money in there.
When she started not asking for money to have some books restored, you know.
Right.
But she has the money to start that.
And it was recommended that she just has that done.
Me with her committee and have come up with a place.
plan that covers everything, not just a few of those small items.
Right.
Right.
A long-term plan.
Right.
Come up with the best estimate you can.
Right.
So I've got like $65,000.
$75,000.
$75.75.
So...
Because $5,000 will put last year.
We had this discussion last year where all these things that were going to happen
and they were told to get that out and come in with a plan and it hasn't happened.
So I think it's another one of those situations where
KVay, do your books.
And it's only $2,000 a book, and you've got, there's plenty of money.
If those have to be done, and those are important, then get those done,
they've got the money to do it.
And then come back with a plan.
Because even if they wait until next year and another $5,000 goes in,
they're not going to spend $60,000 in a year.
Right.
So...
If these books are trashed and fall in part, get done, we've got the money.
Especially when you have to keep them.
Right.
I mean, they're like, they're like, wicked, important.
Right.
historical documents for the town's purposes.
Right. I'd say go ahead and get it done.
And like I said, she's just get the money. And you want to see that.
So when she comes in the CIP next year, it says, look, I did five books.
Or whatever, yeah.
And one might be two grand, one might be three, and one might be $1,500, but that's, like,
white piecemailing when you do have the money in there.
Right.
Well, that was recommended.
She was going to do one book, and we suggested just, and she had got three,
so we suggested just...
Yeah, and I think there might be...
There might be more than that, too.
I think that there were three that were earmarked,
but I want to say there were more than that.
But the money's there, okay, it's done.
Because he can't keep going back to the town of him.
We want money, we want money, and then nothing is spent.
Right.
So...
I'll make the motion that we give them no money.
Second.
All right.
Any of the discussion?
All in favor?
Hi.
Hi.
Any opposed?
Okay.
The important piece of the discussion?
is that we're not saying no to the fact that the money is that there's a committee that's going to come back.
So that's, like, a really important, like, that's something that's going to justify a tax period.
It's like, okay, we're not putting money in, but the committee's going to come back,
and we're going to have a much better way to assess it.
So it doesn't look like we're saying no to the same state to say no.
It's not that they don't deserve it.
It's just that everybody's discussed and even, you know, she's got a committee,
and the town halls have a committee, and...
She has a better clue.
She might get a better deal if she goes to the binding company and so.
There's a tempo. Exactly.
Exactly.
Or three or five or...
Right. Okay.
Did we want to...
I know that she didn't ask for it, but we...
Library didn't ask for technology,
so we're just not going to do anything
with that. She didn't ask for it. Are we going to...
Do we make a motion or not on that? Like, I don't...
This...
What is this? CRF? I have it written
as... Technology improvement.
Computer, office equipment, and records maintenance.
CRF.
Oh, okay. Oh, you're talking the records one.
Okay, stand by.
So the records...
Record management, ETF for the town clerk is...
Is it just records management, or is it...
It's any records management for the town hall or the clerk,
so that could be digital.
That could be...
Most of this stuff is hard copy that she needs to do,
so primarily it's hard copy stuff.
Right.
It can be, if they need to digitize, and that was if there was a cost to that, they could use it for that, too.
But on this spreadsheet, it puts all the municipal software in the same CRF.
If the software is different, the software is...
Oh, you look at computer software equipment, office equipment?
Isn't... I have one CRF that covers all records, all software, all technology.
Nope.
You have...
Your record management, ETF is the one that has the one that has...
74,674. Your computer software, office equipment, ETF, is where the new budget software came out of.
And that's got 49 in it right now. There was 2025 and 48,000 in purchases, which I believe is the,
whatever that T, that's whatever it's called. And then there's an amount, there was a transfer amount this year of 17, which I'm still trying to figure out.
businesses. 40,000 purchases for last year. And then there's transferred amount for this year, 174, with a pending transfer 31.
So I don't know if that's part of the bill or not. All right, I'm sorry, that's 25, 26. So it's like 55,000 in that account.
In the computer office equipment, it's not making sense to me. The starting balance is 99, and there's like 12,000 purchases, so there's a problem there.
That was in expenditures for last year.
So as at 1130, 25, that account had $49,000, theoretically, $49,000, $49,000 in it.
At 1130, however, the projected balance, because of the expenditures, $50,000 is going in it in December,
which balances out of $48,000 for purchases for 2025, so the projected end of year balance is $61,4.
that would be carried over into this year, but it's not making sense because there's a $99,000 bank balance on 1-1, which could be an error.
I'm looking at a $55,000 balance estimate for 1231, like 1231 of 26.
So there's some weird math going on, but we're going to call it around 50, which makes sense based on software purchase.
I just don't know.
was showing $40,000 of purchases, $17 transferred, $31.
Okay, so pending, as of the, when I had this in last year,
they were pending a $31,000 transfer.
So I'm wondering if that $31,000 didn't get transferred.
That's probably what happened is that the trustee to trust funds
didn't make that transfer until 2026,
which would make sense that your $99,000 balance,
transfer the credit in,
accounted. That might make sense.
It might.
Because it seems like we have a weird overlap where
the money is encumbered.
The check is technically cut, so
it's coming out of it. But until the trustee of the trust funds
gets around to
waiving the magic wand, there's a huge hold up there on that.
So what I'm seeing is that even though we've got
things that are earmarked and subtracted,
until they actually
complete the transfer, we may not see that balance change
until the following year, and that seems to be what happened
at the end of last year. So we have all these balance changes that
really were 25 expenditures, but they didn't approve it until
26, which screws up your balance.
Yeah, totally screws it. So there should be, and I don't know how they meet,
I don't know, I don't know, I don't know anything about how they meet,
but it's almost like there should be a,
they should, it's almost like there should be, for some of this stuff,
I know that
quarterly, but
especially at the end of the year,
I don't think we should be
waiting until the next
fiscal year to subtract stuff that was actually
purchased and we know it was purchased
and we paid for it and we took
custody of stuff in 2025.
We shouldn't be waiting for the transfer in 2026.
And there was a huge,
a huge, I mean, the loader
in months, it took months
and months for them to transfer that money.
And it was ridiculous because they've been paid for
and we haven't. Right.
So I don't know if there's a
policy on that
in terms of
Yeah.
Good.
Because that would be really helpful.
Yeah. And even though, I mean,
this is way better than it was because
we had, but even now that I'm looking
at it, now I kind of see why
people wanted it for
different places.
Because when you put it all together,
there is a communication
process
hold up here.
That
I get it, we cover it
because we voted for it.
The product gets ordered,
especially some of the bigger stuff.
It takes time to get that in.
You're not going to pay it for it until you get it.
However, if you pay for it,
it's already been approved to come out of that.
It has to come out of that
because there's no other place for the money
to come out of.
That was my next question.
There should be, if you're making
big expenditures,
then as soon as that check is cut,
the trustees should be needing
within
no more than two weeks after that check
is cut. And there's no reason
why they can't, for a $248,000
balance,
you know, it's not like, you know, yeah, okay,
$1,000 here, 500 there,
okay, be quarterly.
We've got a dump truck coming in.
That's a $300,000
nut that's coming in in
in, what, October?
And that will not end up
get transferred
until probably January.
Which, so
it would, I think it would make everybody's lives easier.
And the other thing, too, is like, finance is trying to figure it out.
Department heads have no idea
how this works.
Like, no, but they're like,
I have not even going to get away on the money.
Right.
And I think that's part of the problem, because there's no,
there's no policy to say, okay, if we're going to spend
over a certain amount of money,
like, we need to, we need to make sure that within two weeks
to trust and trust funds are going, here we go.
Because they don't approve it.
Where's it coming from?
Right, that's trying to figure out.
Where's the, what?
You have all these different accounts,
but then you have actually a checking account,
then actually spending the money.
So really was great.
So when you write the check, are you...
You're taking it out of the general funds...
You're taking it out of the CRF in order to get the money in there, right?
But it can't take out of the C.
So the CRF money doesn't come out
to reimburse the general fund until the trust is trust funds.
Okay, so take it the end of the year...
It's coming out of the check in the general...
Exactly, so.
you're looking at something like, because cruisers, if you order a cruiser on the bid list in
October, it's in September, October, you get it in like March.
But for instance, the loader and the dump truck, or both order like summertime, you get them in
in October, and so you have a $300,000 expenditure that is being taken out of general fund
when you're getting ready to pay your $1.5 million payment to Stratford County, your, what,
$900,000 a month or whatever it is for the freaking school system.
So that's where, if we have a system where get that over,
then you're not running a risk of needing more in your unassigned fund balance.
Right.
Is that why Dickie was screaming at us to have a huge on-assigned fund balance?
Well, no, that was a lot of the reasons for us.
To balance these big things off?
Well, that was what they call justification.
But the thing that is is that you, from an accounting standpoint, it makes no sense.
And especially, you know, like, why are we, why are we, why are we hold, I know that they wanted to
keep these funds as high as possible to get the interest out of them.
Right.
But at the end of the day, from an accounting standpoint, nobody knows,
and it's just really-nilly stuff.
It's like, well, wait a minute.
Like, there's no right of the reason when things are transferred.
So from an accounting to the same point, it makes no sense.
Like, get it out and take it out of the CRF.
At least, especially toward the end of the year,
we can't be carrying these over to 2026.
Because that's what I'm seeing.
I think where the big screwroops are in the accounting is
when you go from 2025 to 2026.
sex. Right. Why don't they...
They're not driving. When they meet in the fourth quarter, why don't they transfer everything?
It's the end of year anyway. The interest is done.
And then the other thing that we have a problem with is that last year, DRA, and it wasn't because
Cawbercraft, because DRA got their stuff in in September, DRA screwed around with it for months,
and they held up the tax rate setting last year.
So I can't remember when bills went out last year. It was a year before that they were wickedly...
it the year before.
So that's the other thing you're running into,
that you can't get any tax revenue in until those tax bills go out.
If they don't go out until December, that means that your people aren't technically due
until January.
So you're playing Russian roulette with the funding.
And, you know, I think that, and I don't know,
it's something that I don't know if the trustee, the trust funds have to set their own policy.
I don't know how that works, but it would make sense.
sense to me that if it's going to be a certain expenditure of over, I don't know,
$100,000, within two weeks of that check being cut, they should be having, it's a four-second
meeting, really, you know, to say, okay, here we go, let's transfer it so that the accounting
is clean, especially if you have. But they're not even making transfers every quarter.
They don't even, they meet quarterly, and they're not even doing transfers then.
Well, no, and I know. That's the part that I really don't get.
That was the issue. I could wait three months, but it's, it's,
like you say, it's willy-nilly. Sometimes they transfer stuff right away, and sometimes they wait nine months.
They did it with a loader, and you're like, why is this taken out, but that's not taken out?
But at the end of the year, that's what's really critical, because you're putting your finance department at the end of the year,
they have to play with all these numbers.
Right. I think an accurate balance if money's haven't been moved into the way it counts.
And you're also trying to balance your books with all the end of the year expenditures from all your departments,
so, which is why I wanted to get budget.
going earlier, so we at least,
so they at least have most of the month to worry about that,
the end of the year stuff. And with all the bills
coming in and getting the bills out for taxes,
I don't understand the rhyme to reason, and it's
all, I don't know, it's not like it's okay, July 1
we meet or whatever, it's almost like, well,
sometimes this quarter will meet and then we'll
maybe move this, or, I don't, it would just make it easier because
this system isn't, this is better, but
I think that part of the problem is that the
transfers aren't being completed in a time of action.
So it screws up the accounting.
But that's what I have for
what we look at. It's somewhere around 50,
which makes sense considering the software. I don't know,
because we didn't get any, we didn't get any request for that.
So I don't know what needs to be purchased.
I do know that
the laptop for the laptop for the Fire Department
will be coming out of fund.
And I know that last year I said,
suggested to Kelly Kostick that her software for the cemetery, I don't know if that was
purchased, I don't know what the status of that nonsense is, but the original software, we suggested
that she requested that that be pulled out of the computer software ETF, and then she
pays for her annual license out of her general budget. So it's like 600 bucks. So that would go
went to her, so we were able to take that $2,600 out because it does fall under
computer software, but I don't know if that ever happened because it was,
at this point it looks like a $12,000 transfers happen this year.
I can't consent with it.
But we also have...
It seems to me that there's a substantial balance there, right, in both those funds based on enough.
Well, for records, yes, which is, so records is different.
The software, nobody submitted anything.
We don't, I don't know.
Right. I don't, nobody even, nobody submitted anything to us last year.
We had no information about the, the cost of the, the financial software.
Right.
And then what other bills or what other stuff?
What annual expenses.
Well, the annual expenses would come out of the general, that would come out of the executive budget.
So the actual software purchase or the computer purchase would, or office equipment.
So if you need, if they were decided, let's go, let's go.
Or we, we need to buy it.
popular.
Right.
I'm assuming they rent.
But we got no submittal last year.
So I have no idea what, aside from the
financial stuff, whether they were looking,
I mean, they were also looking at a time card thing, which I think with the way
of the dodo, like a lot of municipalities have,
is some type of login system that was supposed to happen, and I think that's
off the table now.
That would come out of it.
that. My feeling is for that one, if they, if we don't have an idea what we're purchasing,
and that's another one, we sit back and go, make the request next year.
Right.
The heavy work that needs to be done right now is not going to require.
The big thing was the financial stuff, but a lot of the other, the stuff that really needs to happen
is the things like you're overhauling policies and job descriptions and wage scales and all that kind of stuff.
That's not going to require, that's hands-on kind of thing.
And I think that's going to be a big focus in the next couple months.
So I took up from making a motion that we add nothing to that until somebody comes back next year
and can do a presentation of what we're looking at long-term.
Because there's plenty in there if somebody needs to do a computer.
Especially on that motion.
Not all there.
Do we want to vote on the library technology?
Because she didn't make a request, but where we did the other one, we want to,
I don't want to make the same more complicated, but she covered the ground.
I mean, where we did the facility.
she didn't make a request for it because she got the last one on the thing.
So I make a motion that because nothing was requested that we are recommending that nothing is submitted for library technology improvement.
She's got 5,700 in there right now, and I believe the computers were just purchased relatively recently.
Yes.
It was put in that last year.
So it's been taken out of anything, but request of an updated sheet from Kirsten today, but I don't think she had time to print it out.
Okay.
All right, motion on the tables, put $0 in the library technology equipment to CRF.
Any other discussion?
Very not all in favor?
Hi.
Hi.
Any opposed?
That's 5-0.
Okay.
Wreck or boogie?
Meeting house?
Yeah, I know.
Like, answer.
I'll throw it out there right now.
No.
I'll make a motion for nothing because we have 90, 17, 17, 17,
meeting house and special charitable trust has 17,000 in it. There should have been money replaced for that because of the architectural stuff that should never come out of that. And then they have 95,747 in their meeting house CRF. So you're looking at $110-ish-th-thous-thous-thous-dollar there. The info spilled that there's supposedly $200,000 in the friend's account. That is more than enough to do the roof.
and the windows and button things up, and until people pull up their big boy and big girl pants.
And with the money that's been raised for that toward buttoning the building up, we were sitting on over $300,000, theoretically, sitting on over $300,000, because I don't know if the books have been opened up.
So, we cannot, in good conscience, ask the taxpayers to put any money into this at all.
And that's had some of this.
I've been suggested that they're going to hold some of that money back for phase four.
They can't.
I'm just telling you what you do. I know. I know.
I know. But here's the thing.
The real profit could do anything they want. There are separate entity.
There is separate entity. Here's the thing. If you raise the money, the money is raised for restoration and rehab on their thing.
They can't sit back and go, you know what? We're not spending a thing until all these other things are done, which means the town has to cover that.
They cannot fundraise stuff and then not spend it. So you have a choice to either.
it's like a raffle.
You tell the people we're raising this, they expect it's being used for that.
You can't just go, well, you know what, we're going to save for the part that we want.
That is completely unethical, it is unconscionable, and they can sit on it until the house come home,
and the skies burn as far as I'm concerned.
So they can sit on it for, the Jagger's grandchildren will be dead by the time that gets done.
Because nobody is going to put a sentient to that building.
When we are sitting on,
We're sitting at 95 grand.
And then we've got the
We got the charitable trust.
We've got a plagiarized grant that went in
that nobody's called out.
We have complete mismanaged with the money there
on, you know,
surveying stuff
and plans for stuff that was
never voted on.
You know what? Friends, have the ball.
It's
and it is the
biggest source of
chaos in this community right now.
Is that building?
And it's a shame because people can't get beyond their own egos
and their little personality clerks and whatever.
If you truly want the building to be restored
and you truly want the building to be saved,
guess what?
You can't do a damn thing until you do the timbers,
the roof, the windows, and button it up.
So until that happens, kids,
you ain't get in your kitchen.
You're not getting your conference center.
You're not getting your bathrooms.
You're not getting your little, you know,
walk in the
Memorial Park thing you've got going on.
You're not going to park in a lot.
None of that is happening until that stuff gets done.
So we can have sailing.
Not great. They need to get
reorganized.
Or just be adults.
Yep.
I just, I can't.
Yeah, I know. I just, I don't know.
I can't imagine
going out and soliciting money
and telling people that, you know,
we're going to see in this building and we're going to do this
and we're going to, we're going to restore it in.
I don't care about
the wording, which again,
Warren article needs to be changed, but it's restoration
and rehab. So
they can't just, they can't fundraise for both
people, we're only going to use it for rehab.
They cannot legally do that.
And they're going to have to give it back. And that's fine.
And it's a shame that that has caused
such a curfuffle.
Right.
Every time it's brought up at BOS meetings.
It's ridiculous.
Motion on the table.
Zero dollars for the meeting house.
Sierra. Any of the discussion?
Somebody seconded? Okay.
Any of the discussion?
Here you know, and all in favor.
All in any against?
Okay.
I think that's all the little ones.
What are other? Parks and Rec?
Parks and Rec and Bowie.
Yep.
I make a motion that we
recommend $5,000 for
for Parks and Rec
based on the proposal that you came in with,
which is going back to the original plans
and going back to the fact that
there was an impetus to go down
and start doing stuff down the ball fields, which is happening.
And that's what we asked for,
and I'm comfortable with making the motion for a five-gritty
that she asked for.
It was.
Yeah, yeah, it was fine.
Because I can't, I don't know.
She did, she sent pictures.
Yeah, we asked for you.
And, I mean, to me,
is we laid a little bit of a fire and all, you know,
stuff that, stuff to be done,
and that's what people want to see.
So I think that
when someone does what we ask them to do,
that needs to be rewarded.
Okay, $5,000.
Can we second to that?
Thank you.
Kevin.
This is Kevin.
Kevin, Kevin needs one.
Kevin? All right.
Any other discussion on that?
Very none? All in favor?
Aye.
Aye.
Any against? No.
Okay, next.
I made the motion that we,
I believe it was 3750.
Again, I don't, whatever,
whatever Kathy came in recommending,
this is the 18th year in a row.
She's come in with all of her numbers and everything,
and she's done her work,
and we should let the taxpayers decide
what they want to do with that,
and the focus of the board's suck,
and we'll put that on the warrant art.
Your Sierra off? Yes.
And then to deposit 37.50.
Yes.
She has for Sierra, right? Not me, T.m.m.
I think she lets the board a selectman
to figure out what flavor it is.
Okay. I want to ask a stupid question.
What's the difference?
If you could mix and match it, like,
what would make it an ETF as opposed to
CRF for something like this?
Right.
I don't, I think a letter to permit it.
I don't really understand the difference.
Okay, so I'm not feeling too stupid now.
Okay, good.
No.
The legal definition is in the
in the report, and I put it in last year.
So expendable trust fund as opposed to a capital reserve fund.
Right.
It's in the report.
I don't know if I have the report online.
But she doesn't, because I'm looking at, like, town buildings is an ETF, which seems silly.
You think that would be a capital reserve fund.
This is a capital reserve project.
Right.
Is it just how the money is spent?
It's the rules about how it's, yeah, how it's, how it's created, how it's spent, how it's, how it's, how a capital reserve fund works.
It says management or a designee agent, and just spending of these funds.
So it's seen by the town's trust, we can get the trust, and the trust.
the same way, though.
Because you still have to have the board of selectmen approve it and your trustee of trust funds.
The authorization is the select board right here.
And both are specific to what the fund is.
There's a difference in, like, interest rates.
She didn't have a preference?
No, she said, uh, what if the board of selectmen decides they want to do,
how would they want to do it?
I'll amend my motion to be, to 37, 50 into
a new CRF or ETF as determined by the statutory governing body?
Right.
The computer and office equipment is an ETF.
Crewed benefits is an ETF.
Assuming this is correct.
Records management is an ETF.
Surplus vehicle is an ETF.
Town building improvement is an ETF.
Town Master Plan is a CRAF.
This makes no sense.
What surplus vehicles?
Surplus vehicles.
vehicle equipment E.T.F.
That's, I don't know that that's even been used in the facilitating years of $2,600 in it,
and I can't remember, I can't remember off the tap in my head what that was.
I think that was if you had the opportunity to pick up surplus vehicle from, like, the military, or.
Yeah, I think so.
I think that's what that was for.
I, it hasn't been used it forever, nothing's been put into it, and that is different than the vehicle equipment.
it's, which is CRF.
So it's almost like they just, somebody just decided,
we'll just name it this I'm giving here.
Your libraries are CRFs.
include your CRF.
It's a CRF.
Because it's almost like, yeah, I don't know.
There's got to be a difference.
Because the spending is, I mean, the policy is the same.
You can't use these, you have to use it for what the warrant article suggests.
Cemetery improvements was a CRF.
And then they have two expendable charitable trust.
one for ZBF and one for the meeting house.
It was a second. Is there a second?
Okay, 10 seconds.
An interesting number.
Well, just, she, I know, 37, 50, 57.
That would fine. Let's put some odd change in there.
That would have to send somebody over a loose.
That's capping.
She always does everything.
And we get deposited in pennies, please.
She got her estimate of her 10-year expense.
Oh, she got the cost of what she think it will be in 10 years.
Big guess on,
for asphalt, big jests, big jests, and then she just provided that number by 10.
You know, and again, the same thing with rec.
The new public is that they did what we asked them to do.
It was a huge difference in rec this year from last year.
Kathy came in doing the same thing, which she always does down to the penny.
Every nut and bolt is accounted for.
And that's, um, Kathy's preparation is the standard for this.
that we want department that's doing.
So Kathy's putting all this work in as a volunteer for that for $37.50,
and she's coming in with binders and pictures and all this other stuff.
There's no reason why we can't, we should be seeing that with everybody else,
and that markets it.
Like, how do you say no to that?
Right.
And then you leave it up to the taxpayers who say, is that what they want?
I want to do the work, just give me the money.
Right.
Who seconded that?
Ken.
Any other discussion on this motion?
Hearing none.
All in favor?
Aye.
Any guess?
No, that's five.
Any little ones left?
So I think that's it for, so we don't do that.
That's dear maintenance.
We don't believe that long.
Yes.
The municipal facilities.
That's the $7 million.
That's all right.
I don't know nothing about.
You know what?
Part of me wants to say that we...
You put $5,000 in it.
You know, part of me wants to say that we,
because we have no plan,
because nobody presents anything,
we don't know anything,
that we are actually voting to put nothing in it,
because at the end of the year,
we want the taxpayers to know that there are all the,
there are 30-something funds that we put money into.
But we chose 10.
Right.
We're not...
I mean, that shows that responsibility of,
unless we get the plan, unless we know what's happening,
unless we, you know,
how can we, in good conscience,
put in money into buying property at this point?
When that was set up,
they had property that they were looking at.
But we have nothing.
So those are two that I feel comfortable going
and make a motion so the taxpayers
go, yep, until there's a plan,
we're not touching it.
And then if the Board of Selectmen wants to change that,
they can completely do that.
But there's still this group that's saying,
yeah, no, we're not doing it.
And we've done our job in terms of vetting it out
and saying to the public,
we're not in support of doing anything here
because we're trying to be fiscally responsible
and account for it.
And there's, you know, we put $80,000 a billion in it.
I mean, we put a round number all day long.
It doesn't mean it's going to be spent.
Right.
So.
Yeah.
So, it's a round number.
There's the, where the hell is it,
there's municipal facility land acquisition,
CRF. And then there is the,
you think they put, then
public safety facility, CRF, which
Right. Yeah. So that's, I mean, and right now that's
specifically only for public safety, but that was done
when they had put, you know,
the thing with the $12 million, whatever heck it was.
That's got 182 in it.
And the public facilities,
Public facilities has 182, 182, 818, and it's a little bit of change.
Municipal Facility Land Acquisition has $11,000 in it.
So we're sitting on $300,000 that there's no plan for.
Right.
Oh, we've been sitting on these for years.
Yeah.
So one is the public safety facility, CRF.
And that's 182-8-18, municipal facility land acquisition.
CRIF which has 111-612 again roughly because I don't know what the newer
interest rates are. So we did not, nothing was requested last year. I want to say
that the select board did put one on there and it was voted down. And then the year
before public safety facilities, there was nothing submitted in 20 for it was put
into that in 2025 is full yeah this is the one with the the select board
decided to put 50 grand into the municipal land fund in 2025 they put yeah so 2025 they put
yeah so 2025 they put on a warmer up we'll put 50 yeah which kind of well
we haven't made one yet we still we have those too so I'll make a motion to that we do
not fund make but do not make a recommendation to fund the public safety's safety facilities
to no plan no vision no proposal no basically putting it on hold until we somebody
comes forth with a vision discussion very none all in favor I am opposed
did I do safety facilities I'm interested okay so moving right along I think
emotionally do the same thing we miss the miss the municipal facility land
acquisition CRF by making the recommendation to not to fund that
CRF for the same race as the public works facility.
Second.
Until there's a vision.
All favor?
Aye.
Oh, you know, we do have to do,
the proposal for, I don't really know if she was doing,
she doesn't even have, she did do a proposal
is not, I don't think it's going to,
it's not going to apply because it is class six.
Right.
But, so I don't know if we have to,
This isn't normal. She doesn't even have what CRF is it?
Well, that was the question.
Because one part of it was she adding it on to the, she has water quality of milk oil
syrup, but it looked like she might be asking for a separate one for it.
And so, I don't know if we should be...
Oh, she requested.
It was a 60-something thousand.
Oh, it was 80-something.
Because it was a total of like 164,000, I think.
So I think it was 82.
But the bigger issue that, and I tried to talk some sense into her with regard to this.
Her budget proposed a 100% last year, she made no request for Milboil.
And so, because with all that was supposed to be done,
a little bit like $22,000 in that CRF right now.
and with what she wanted to do last year, she's not going to get it done with what was granted on the general operating card.
And she said she was burned out by doing the last proposal, but at the end of the day, do we want more quality funded?
Because the places to do it is the CRF.
Right.
Because I'll tell you right now, I will, you know, budget committee can do what they want, but my, my push is going to be,
that is a, that's infrastructure.
And that covers the basics.
We cannot, you know, we can't keep putting money into that
and then have no control over what it's used for
because a board can move it to another completely separate thing.
They can decide not to spend it.
And then it zeroes out.
Whereas if you put the money into a CRF,
where it can only be used for water quality in malefoil,
for every body water and the watershed in town,
the money's earmarked for that can only be here as earmark for that
and it doesn't zero out and go to the general fund
at the end of the season.
I know that we get about 15 grand every year on a grant,
but what I'm looking at for this, for the balance for,
I know there was this expenditures too, right of 22,000,
but I'm trying to figure out the adding and subtracting
was going on here because there was, she said $44,000 in 2025.
She had $38,000, January 2025, $44,000 in purchases.
As of the printout, there was a $38, $35,000 transfer.
There was $5,200 that hadn't been transferred with a rough estimate of a balance
for 1130 to 25 being 111, but there was a $25,000,
there was a $25,000 deposit because the taxpayers voted to put $25,000 in it.
That buffed up to $23,000 for the end of December 31st of 2025.
So she spent 44 out of that fund in one year.
That's a significant chunk of change.
I know that 15 came in, but it doesn't, it can't go into that.
That ended up in general fund.
I looked at her, I, I,
I can't remember what, there were a couple issues to the quarterlies,
but I do have concerns because right now there's $22,000 in that.
And there is a, $22,000, but there is a $1,200,000 purchase as of, like, May or June that was
encumbered, but hadn't been transferred yet.
She didn't provide any estimate of, like, what's the cost of all this?
I mean, there's a lot of cost.
And I know there was some.
money to get a ticket thing that needed to be done.
So the water testing needs to be paid for.
I'm concerned about that long-term,
at least trying to maintain stuff, you know?
But that's the only money we can question.
Yeah, and that's, yeah.
And that really should be under a separate syrup anyway.
Because that would be dependent on the grant.
That would be dependent on, that's just one particular big project at 164.
You can't, good conscience, wipe out your entire CRI for potentially a couple hundred feet of water access.
Right.
And if it's class six, then town can't be a port anyway.
Can't do it.
Yeah, can't get a grant.
It's not decided, but it seems the evidence.
But, do it, it's, it, we have to wait, it would change, you know, it started out,
it had to be a classified with it.
And I still don't think it's settled.
No, it's not finally settled.
I was talking to Kathy today about that.
It's not finally settled.
It's leaning towards class six, but it's currently in the hands of town council.
Yeah, but the court was pretty definitive.
I had the email from the class.
Yeah, no.
And his thing was like, hey, good look at the project.
But here's the deal.
There is, because the law was repealed, what she was basing on, it's washed.
You also have the fact that any new class five,
So both launches are supposed to be in class three now.
And then the five stuff doesn't apply to something that was done in 1957 because governor counsel did it.
There is nothing on, there's no law in the books and there's no process to undo what governor counsel and the governor did at the time in 1957.
So even if you wanted to do it, the town cannot change until class five.
The state has to do it, but there's no, there's no process of place.
There's no legal process to do it.
it. It's not happening. I mean, that's the bottom line. So, you know, counsel can kick it, touch,
a taste, and lick it all they want. At the end of the day, she cannot apply for that.
But we can't do any of it. It's, you're burning money. And at the same time, we're not going to fund,
we're going to cut our nose to spite our face and go, well, fine, I'm not going to put any money
in the milk, you know, I'm too burned out, so I'm not going to, I'm not even to bother putting money
into the milfoil CRF. I mean, that's ridiculous. So we either give a shit about our water
quality in the entire community, not just shop on, but we don't. And if we're not going to fund
it, then we should stop doing the testing altogether because she's not getting a 300% increase
in her budget this year. It's not happening. It's level funded. So she's getting no more than what
she was authorized last year by the town vote.
Because the edict to everybody is level-funded.
The last time she met with us, she suggested that it didn't matter whether it was a class 5 or class 6-year-old.
She could still get the grant.
It just had to be a guarantee that the road would be maintained.
But you can't, the town has no.
No, no, no, not maintained by the town.
It could even be maintained by the property of the owner is there.
That's what she suggested.
I mean, I'll make a motion right now that we completely, we do not consider her proposal.
Because there are too many what-ifs, it's too expensive, the extra money that she has, the batching money,
she, there's a couple different grants, there's no guarantee.
She was qualified for it and had, it was like a good idea if it was in class five.
That, she's got to go back and get guarantees from every.
you down that. I'll tell you right now, one of the owners down there does not want.
Absolutely not. It's not going to happen.
I've been telling you what she said it the last time we've been. It's been all over the place.
And she's not vetted things out.
So, and I haven't seen her budget yet. It's due to do the budget to do on the 14th, two days for now.
She's walking the Appalachian Trail and she wanted to do a budget meeting before the 29th because she's leaving.
And I'm like, we're not, at this point,
we either give a shit about water quality or we don't.
And if it's going to be, I'm going to take my ball and go home if I don't get my project,
then we've got a problem, and we need to be looking at,
somebody needs to be looking at all this, the other water that needs to be tested.
Well, if we're going to give them a water, then you've got to include all of them.
And that's what, that's my thing. So her thing was, she's making a proposal for that.
She's not making a proposal for anything else other than Shaw's Palm,
which, again, we also have the issue because she's a property owner on.
So that's a huge issue.
She's benefiting her own property value.
And then, sure, well, I'm going to sell my house.
Well, that's ridiculous.
Sell your house.
You're on a committee to ensure the water quality for everybody that's a community on any body,
no matter who the taxpayer is, whether they have a property on it or not.
And if that is what our passion is, then you at least submit a proposal to go,
hey, we want to make sure our testing gets funded because, again, there is.
She is not getting a penny more than what she put in for last year because no department's getting a penny more than what they sit in the last year for their operating stuff.
Other than the raises and the things we can't control, like your benefits and things like electricity and whatever.
But what can be controlled will be controlled and it's zero.
So she's getting nothing more.
Therefore, the only other way you're going to take care of funding that, which has been historically somewhere between 35 and 40-something thousand a year,
is to put money into a CRF.
Now, is the CRF for all of the bodies?
Yep. Okay. Okay. So it's one CRF for all?
One, yeah. So it's water quality and milk foil. So it's not just milk foil. It's, and it's for all bodies of water and watersheds.
So it covers the testing for every, and they're, and she's out there, she's testing, I mean, they're testing like the cows come home.
And they're, like, I would think,
that we want to be able to continue that. I don't know. I just, I'm, yes, it doesn't make
sense to me not to submit. She didn't, she didn't, she refused to come in and request it
because somebody gave her some ridiculous idea that she could go in and get it approved by the budget
committee. And I'm like, I said to her, I go, you need, you really, you really, no, I'm like,
okay. Because if it doesn't get voted in, you don't get the money. And I, and I, and I really, and they were
kind of pooing that couple of music.
go, it's like, oh, taxpayers would it do. The taxpayers absolutely would have funded
employer, following my mind. No question in my mind. As a separate, because that, you know,
the way I look at it is that we're giving taxpayers a choice as to what they want to spend
their money on, which is why I think, you know, the people are coming to do the work, whether I
agree on the project or not, that's not for me to decide. They come in and do the work,
it's for us to say, yep, let's taxpayers vote on it. And then they decide, which they should do.
But when you're able to say, because with the budget,
it's all or nothing. Whereas at least
for this, we go, you know what, I like water following.
And I think the wreck should have five grand. And I think that
that's a choice. And I think
it's never been an issue
before. I don't think it's never been turned down. Has
it's got? No, it hasn't. Because she's been
funded every year. With the
exception of last year, because she didn't request it.
So what did the response to
put something in that Sierra
and that was. And that was what my point was.
That the water
test is paramount, right? Right.
But with the caveat that
what would do is we say
definitive, like my motion right now is that
we are not funding that project.
We are not making any recommendation for it because she would
need a new CRF or ETF for it.
And it's only shot pond.
And there's too many what-ifs that
my
motion will be that. We do not fund that.
And then the water quality CRF would be
a different vote or a different motion.
So we're...
So there's two different
CRIFs. One from Millpoil and one for what?
No.
Water quality meal is the same CRF.
In order for her to do
what she wanted to do, she
was looking at doing a new CRF
for the Shaw Pond thing.
I don't know how that would work with
grant money because the grant money can't go into a CRF.
So that's another issue.
You can't put grant money into a CRF.
So
it's a totally separate thing.
So that's what she came into the proposal for.
So my motion is that we
recommend not to fund it
not to fund that shop on.
project.
There's no guarantee, it's not fetted out,
the two-me-whitts, and it only
just one thing. And then
we vote on that, one way or another,
and then we look at
the water quality
of milk oil separately for all bodies of
water. My original don't
fund to chuck off.
Right.
In the last year's report, it says that
it was suggested last year that the
expenditures for this purpose,
the water quality, no fuel, CRF,
you put it in the operating bucket.
No, we didn't recommend it.
No.
Someone else did.
It was suggested last year
previous, that
expense for this purpose, we put an operating bucket.
This year, however, that is still
open. So there is
confusion as to its status.
The recommendation
was made to her not to submit
from an outside entity.
And I'm not going to, I'm assuming
it was a board to select one thing. I don't know.
So, because she
did come in and ask for 25 the year before
and she got it.
Last year, she didn't come in
and make any proposal at all.
Right.
So, and we talked about it,
budget committee, so I'm like, because we were
still, like, paralleling at that point.
And I'm like, that's how we got
Kelly Kossack in here. Like, really should be,
nope, not going to go look at it.
So, I don't know
where that came from. It was very ill
advised. It was a poor financial
decision. Whoever
thought it was a bright idea, it's not a right idea.
Because
as you can see, we have
essentially default
budget. But we're also,
I'm definitively saying she is not
getting a penny more because that's what
the directive was to all department has.
Level funded,
zero-based budgeting.
And if they don't come in level-funded,
it's getting hacked.
And that's across the board.
So there will be zero increase for
the infrastructure stuff the department has
coming in, the only budget increases will be those things that we can't control that the town halls deals with, like, your propade or your raises, they'll decide that. They'll decide, you know, if insurance going up, so that we're looking at, we're hoping for, like, no more than three to four percent with all those things that we can't control, if we make sure the departments come in at level funded, and that's not to say that they're going to get the level funding,
there are budgets that I'm looking at now, that there will be
cuts to level funded budgets. No question based on quarterly and what I'm watching for
money playing. So that the hope is that we offset that so we're only looking at a total
3% or 4% increase overall with the stuff that we can't control. And then if we can do that
and we're judicious, especially where we're looking at, I mean, we're literally a boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
And we've got what, 101, 100,000, 100,000,000,000.
six, we're at a hundred and ten thousand dollars right now. That's it. So we're at a really
good place to buy the fire truck, we're given the smaller people, their stuff, we're in a good
place to go, okay, we can do something with the DPW stuff, and we can still put money into
water quality and essentially look like rock stars in terms of, like, hey people, because
At the end of the day, that's what? We'll fund those things because it's the right thing to do, and we're not looking at an 80-billion percent increase in our tax rate.
Right.
But, you know, it's just my opinion. I don't know what other people, but I am worried about. I'm worried. We don't fund it at all. Where's it coming from?
Right. Do you have the current budget in your computer there? Can you see if water quality is in the budget?
Oh, water quality is in the budget.
Well, then we don't need to give them anything in the CRF.
Because I thought that that was the whole thing.
I thought that they wanted to do it through the...
No, she wanted to fund it totally.
She cannot, she cannot fund it in the general fund
because it was a 3752% increase.
She went from like $8,000 a year to like $50.
That is not happening.
It's not happening.
Because, and again, as we saw
last year and the last five or six years,
which is what we had had auditing issues,
we're robbing peer to pay Paul,
and the department head can
but if the select board says, oh, you know what,
we have a problem with
the police department budget, we need to go pull money,
we're taking $10,000 from milfoil, because
we can do that.
There is nothing to stop them from doing that.
And that's an issue.
And then at the end of the year, what isn't spent goes back
into your general fund.
So there's no guarantee that the money
that goes in there is spent on what
needs to happen.
And it's user
lose it at the end of the year. So
when you're looking at a chair. You want to get
a milk oil budget back in Sierra out of the general.
Well, it's not going to be out of it. There's certain things that come in.
She has like a nine,
I think it's like a 9,000-ish budget.
For some reason, I don't know why.
She gets mileage. There are
certain things that are in
her budget for like an infrastructure
kind of thing.
She has lap testing for all of water quality
samples.
She has lab. But
There's, I guess you're going to see if you're going to pull it up.
But roughly speaking,
the big chuck of stuff that she needs to do
that was coming out of the CRF
was a total of $25,000,
give or take in addition to the nine grand
that would be in her
general operating fund.
And then there would be a 50,
and that was the other thing, we're getting a $15,000
on a grant that
I asked
Paul and Kirsten to look at something where
we're getting that grant money.
We want that as offsetting revenue.
for that's a part of your if you
earn the grant it should be
it should be going somewhere
where it can't be thrown to the general
funds right to be used for
tidilywinks. Right.
If you get a grant for Milfoyle
instead of taxing taxpayers
for that extra 15 when we're getting grant money
that we're paying for and we know
that it's going to milpoint and that is not what's been happening
that's been the big issue with the only grant
funding that's been going into the actual
place that's supposed to go is library
and
um
and DPW because the block grant has to
go to RSMS, so nobody can touch that.
But that's where
there's a lot of funky stuff
going on with that. I'm going to see if I
know I have her quarterlies in here somewhere.
What was the
justification to go from $8,000
to $50,000? Because she was taking
everything out of, she wasn't putting money
into the CRF.
So
I want to say she was
3702% increase.
And it was the same thing with Kelly.
Kelly wasn't going to come
into, because nobody
realized that we had those funds
and whatever, and she came in and she was another
one that was like, didn't she request like $40,000?
When her budget, they did it like $10,000,
and she requested $40 in the general operating fund
to do the big project, which was really a CRF project,
and those ended up getting
obviously turned out.
This is the other thing, too, is that you end up on, people don't,
if they're going to default the budget,
they're going to default it no matter what you're asking for.
So, everybody gets, potentially everybody gets screwed.
The smaller budget, budgets get screwed more.
Right.
You know, unless somebody says, you know, I want,
you can't turn around and go,
I want
one-point-two-minute-dollar budget, but I want a guarantee
that $40,000 of that it goes into nilful.
You can't do it that way.
It's like one bulk number.
So.
So there's a motion on a second for the $0.00.
For the stock product,
Kahn project.
Just one on a table, but I can get back to you on the...
Okay.
The request of the itemized expenditures
to match it up.
And,
but I know there were a lot of expenditures
that had not been, like, the testing
had not been paid for yet.
And I think, so I'd
have to get back to people on that.
All right.
But we still, like I said, we had the motion to the other one of the tables.
Yep.
All right.
Any of the discussion on the
putting zero in the straws
on.
X. I'm calling it a shot's on axis frame project.
That's good.
All right. I like that. Okay.
Okay.
Any of the session on that?
All in favor?
Hi.
Hi. Any against?
Okay.
So do we have
a motion
for the milfoil
CRF?
Well, here's my...
Where do we want to wait on that?
It's getting late. I wonder if this is what you're going to draw.
I mean, I mean,
at two schools, thought,
that we can, I can
dig it up.
And, because we're going to have to come back
and talk about the six
CRFs for highway anyway.
And we can put it on that,
and then I can give you more definitive,
well, theoretically more definitive numbers
in terms of what she had spent
as of July 1st.
We still have, there's a lot more testing
and stuff that's going on,
but that will give you a better idea of,
with the itemized expenditures,
if you guys want me to get that to you,
and then we can throw them.
with the other CRFs for the next time you need.
Right. Yep.
That sounds good.
Are we looking for what the average per year
cost isn't there for a test?
It's been. Is that what we're going to?
That's basically what I'm interested in.
But historically, we get
50%. So we're getting
somewhere between 12 and 15,000
grant every year. So it's, we're looking at
30 grand debt
had been coming out of CRF.
Right. In addition to whatever
we put into the general.
Because it's kind of like, for instance, like Booty,
the Booty Farmstead has this charitable trust.
They have the charitable trust.
She's looking for her CRF.
She's got a general fund budget.
Meeting House has a general fund budget.
Right.
They're small.
Right.
But they have them.
And that covers your basics.
Like, for instance, like all of the people on the water poli,
there was training that they went to.
It was like 112 bucks a piece kind of thing.
So it's training, mileage, certain things fall into it.
And I think historically the stuff that was involved in the grant for the long-term
milfoil plan and the water quality plan was thrown into that Sierra activity.
I know I have last year's itemized because they requested it after a lot of kicking and screaming.
And now I'm getting it regularly with
quarterly, so I may be able to pull up two years of stuff.
Okay. Right.
Decision. But I will definitively tell you that
that she will not be getting anything more than what is in her budget now.
Okay.
So we're talking 10 grand and that's it.
All right. We don't want to stop here then?
Yeah.
I think it's getting late.
How many minutes do we have, Kevin, completed this?
The July 2nd one's right?
July 2nd is, right?
July 2nd is just at the,
Me and adjourned, I made the motion to adjourn, but to keep it consistent, if we just put Kristen on it,
because that's what I'm called to the rest of it.
I really care what I've called, but it's Chris with an eye and we don't want to get into that.
So it's just so Kristen.
That's all I saw.
We're at normal board.
I'm going to start referring to myself in the third person.
Kristen, thanks.
Every single time I give you two minutes, that that's...
We need for a cemetery also.
Not finished up Saturday.
Last line on the first page.
What's that?
The last line on the first page.
Okay, yeah, recommendation was brought forward.
Vetted.
Not revetting.
It's vetted.
Allie for Kai.
Yeah.
For Kai.
This is.
Recommendation was brought forward to replace Allie from Ken.
Okay, Ken made the recommendation.
Ken recommended Kai to be vetted.
Bedded.
Vetted.
That is slide 14 to be on that's going on favor of favor of, okay.
July 2nd.
You don't all in favor?
Aye.
Any deaths?
This week is DPW.
W, water quality, and cemetery, and anything else we missed.
It's going to drive me nuts.
You guys can motion all day long.
I'm just going to see if there's anything else to do.
I'll just me a second to get the packet would come up.
Yeah.