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Downshifting Forum 2026

Video

All right. Well, good evening everyone.
All right. Well, good evening everyone. Can everyone hear me? All right. See a
Can everyone hear me? All right. See a
Can everyone hear me? All right. See a lot of head nods shaking. Thank you. My
lot of head nods shaking. Thank you. My
lot of head nods shaking. Thank you. My name is Senator Donovan Fenton and I'm
name is Senator Donovan Fenton and I'm
name is Senator Donovan Fenton and I'm proud to represent this community. I
proud to represent this community. I
proud to represent this community. I want to thank you all for taking the
want to thank you all for taking the
want to thank you all for taking the time to be here uh tonight to join us on
time to be here uh tonight to join us on
time to be here uh tonight to join us on an important conversation about the
an important conversation about the
an important conversation about the future of our communities and our
future of our communities and our
future of our communities and our property taxes. Tonight's discussion is
property taxes. Tonight's discussion is
property taxes. Tonight's discussion is focused on something that many of you
focused on something that many of you
focused on something that many of you are feeling directly, and that is rising
are feeling directly, and that is rising
are feeling directly, and that is rising property taxes, increasing pressure on
property taxes, increasing pressure on
property taxes, increasing pressure on local budgets, and the growing gap
local budgets, and the growing gap
local budgets, and the growing gap between what the state funds and what
between what the state funds and what
between what the state funds and what municipalities are expected to deliver.
municipalities are expected to deliver.
municipalities are expected to deliver. Over the past several years, we have
Over the past several years, we have
Over the past several years, we have seen what's called cost downshifting,
seen what's called cost downshifting,
seen what's called cost downshifting, where the state reduces its fair share
where the state reduces its fair share
where the state reduces its fair share of funding, and that responsibility
of funding, and that responsibility
of funding, and that responsibility falls directly onto cities, towns,
falls directly onto cities, towns,
falls directly onto cities, towns, counties, and ultimately the people in
counties, and ultimately the people in
counties, and ultimately the people in this room, the property taxpayers. We're
this room, the property taxpayers. We're
this room, the property taxpayers. We're also seeing this play out in education
also seeing this play out in education
also seeing this play out in education where even the modest increases in
where even the modest increases in
where even the modest increases in school budgets can result in significant
school budgets can result in significant
school budgets can result in significant spikes in local tax rates because of
spikes in local tax rates because of
spikes in local tax rates because of declining state aid. We're fortunate to
declining state aid. We're fortunate to
declining state aid. We're fortunate to have a strong panel with us here tonight
have a strong panel with us here tonight
have a strong panel with us here tonight with different perspectives across local
with different perspectives across local
with different perspectives across local and regional government. I'd like to
and regional government. I'd like to
and regional government. I'd like to introduce them now. We have Chris Coats,
introduce them now. We have Chris Coats,
introduce them now. We have Chris Coats, Cheshire County Administrator. We have
Cheshire County Administrator. We have
Cheshire County Administrator. We have Elizabeth Furland, Keen City Manager,
Elizabeth Furland, Keen City Manager,
Elizabeth Furland, Keen City Manager, Robert Malay, superintendent of Keen
Robert Malay, superintendent of Keen
Robert Malay, superintendent of Keen School District, and Margaret Burns,
School District, and Margaret Burns,
School District, and Margaret Burns, executive director of the New Hampshire
executive director of the New Hampshire
executive director of the New Hampshire Municipal Association. Thank you all for
Municipal Association. Thank you all for
Municipal Association. Thank you all for being here and for the work you guys do
being here and for the work you guys do
being here and for the work you guys do every day. Now, before we begin, um, we
every day. Now, before we begin, um, we
every day. Now, before we begin, um, we should have had note cards sent out to
should have had note cards sent out to
should have had note cards sent out to you guys. We are getting the note cards
you guys. We are getting the note cards
you guys. We are getting the note cards now, so they'll arrive in a second. U,
now, so they'll arrive in a second. U,
now, so they'll arrive in a second. U, please write down your questions
please write down your questions
please write down your questions throughout the discussion. We're going
throughout the discussion. We're going
throughout the discussion. We're going to collect those and move into a Q&A
to collect those and move into a Q&A
to collect those and move into a Q&A around 7 PM. So, some questions tonight
around 7 PM. So, some questions tonight
around 7 PM. So, some questions tonight will be directed to specific panelists
will be directed to specific panelists
will be directed to specific panelists and others will be open and I encourage
and others will be open and I encourage
and others will be open and I encourage I encourage everyone on the panel to
I encourage everyone on the panel to
I encourage everyone on the panel to jump in where it makes sense. So, we're
jump in where it makes sense. So, we're
jump in where it makes sense. So, we're going to get right into it. How did we
going to get right into it. How did we
going to get right into it. How did we get here? Let's start with the big
get here? Let's start with the big
get here? Let's start with the big picture. This question is open to all
picture. This question is open to all
picture. This question is open to all the panelists. How would each of you
the panelists. How would each of you
the panelists. How would each of you describe how we got to this point where
describe how we got to this point where
describe how we got to this point where local governments and property taxpayers
local governments and property taxpayers
local governments and property taxpayers are carrying more of the financial
are carrying more of the financial
are carrying more of the financial burden? And Chris, if you'd like to kick
burden? And Chris, if you'd like to kick
burden? And Chris, if you'd like to kick us off. Before
us off. Before
us off. Before we get going, if there's people that are
we get going, if there's people that are
we get going, if there's people that are looking for seats, there are some seats.
looking for seats, there are some seats.
looking for seats, there are some seats. There's two seats down here. There's
There's two seats down here. There's
There's two seats down here. There's another seat here. There's about six or
another seat here. There's about six or
another seat here. There's about six or seven seats I see around, so you don't
seven seats I see around, so you don't
seven seats I see around, so you don't have to stand if you don't want to.
have to stand if you don't want to.
have to stand if you don't want to. You may sit next to somebody you don't
You may sit next to somebody you don't
You may sit next to somebody you don't know, but that's okay.
>> All right. All right. So to follow up
>> All right. All right. So to follow up folks, the question was, how would each
folks, the question was, how would each
folks, the question was, how would each of you describe how we got to this point
of you describe how we got to this point
of you describe how we got to this point where local governments and property
where local governments and property
where local governments and property taxpayers are carrying more of the
taxpayers are carrying more of the
taxpayers are carrying more of the financial burden and essentially what's
financial burden and essentially what's
financial burden and essentially what's changed over the past decade in terms of
changed over the past decade in terms of
changed over the past decade in terms of this? Microphone.
>> All right. Never mind.
>> All right. Never mind. >> Never mind. Good evening. Thank you for
>> Never mind. Good evening. Thank you for
>> Never mind. Good evening. Thank you for taking Thank you for taking the time to
taking Thank you for taking the time to
taking Thank you for taking the time to be here tonight. Um, two quick things.
be here tonight. Um, two quick things.
be here tonight. Um, two quick things. You'll notice that we do have a camera
You'll notice that we do have a camera
You'll notice that we do have a camera in the back. We are filming this so that
in the back. We are filming this so that
in the back. We are filming this so that we can while I'll I'll get the film,
we can while I'll I'll get the film,
we can while I'll I'll get the film, we'll send it out to others so that they
we'll send it out to others so that they
we'll send it out to others so that they can put it on their website so you can
can put it on their website so you can
can put it on their website so you can share it with others or people can view
share it with others or people can view
share it with others or people can view it and uh go from there. I also want you
it and uh go from there. I also want you
it and uh go from there. I also want you to know that when you came in, you may
to know that when you came in, you may
to know that when you came in, you may have seen that we had the county had
have seen that we had the county had
have seen that we had the county had some documents. Hopefully you you all
some documents. Hopefully you you all
some documents. Hopefully you you all got them and it's really a document that
got them and it's really a document that
got them and it's really a document that breaks down um our departments. It
breaks down um our departments. It
breaks down um our departments. It breaks down our programming, our
breaks down our programming, our
breaks down our programming, our staffing, and then the backside a lot of
staffing, and then the backside a lot of
staffing, and then the backside a lot of numbers that I think you're you're
numbers that I think you're you're
numbers that I think you're you're looking for. It's just so you had an
looking for. It's just so you had an
looking for. It's just so you had an idea. We have that for every town in the
idea. We have that for every town in the
idea. We have that for every town in the county because you remember we have 22
county because you remember we have 22
county because you remember we have 22 counties in the city of Keen in Cheshire
counties in the city of Keen in Cheshire
counties in the city of Keen in Cheshire County. So, how did we get here? Um,
County. So, how did we get here? Um,
County. So, how did we get here? Um, so you know what's what's interesting to
so you know what's what's interesting to
so you know what's what's interesting to me is that the state in the late60s
me is that the state in the late60s
me is that the state in the late60s they they actually
some people call it the great reform at
some people call it the great reform at the time because they really took a look
the time because they really took a look
the time because they really took a look at how they could work handinhand with
at how they could work handinhand with
at how they could work handinhand with towns with municipalities with you know
towns with municipalities with you know
towns with municipalities with you know counties and with the school district
counties and with the school district
counties and with the school district and a lot out of that came a lot of
and a lot out of that came a lot of
and a lot out of that came a lot of great ideas around funding supports, you
great ideas around funding supports, you
great ideas around funding supports, you know, from, you know, well, you know,
know, from, you know, well, you know,
know, from, you know, well, you know, the pension plan is is a great example
the pension plan is is a great example
the pension plan is is a great example of something that came out in 1967,6867
of something that came out in 1967,6867
of something that came out in 1967,6867 and there were other, you know, business
and there were other, you know, business
and there were other, you know, business profit profit sharing that went on and
profit profit sharing that went on and
profit profit sharing that went on and and it was just a time where they were
and it was just a time where they were
and it was just a time where they were looking at how how to work together. But
looking at how how to work together. But
looking at how how to work together. But over the years, what we've seen is is
over the years, what we've seen is is
over the years, what we've seen is is that it's gone away from that type of
that it's gone away from that type of
that it's gone away from that type of thought. And because of that, it's put
thought. And because of that, it's put
thought. And because of that, it's put an incredible pressure on I can speak
an incredible pressure on I can speak
an incredible pressure on I can speak for the county, but I think everybody on
for the county, but I think everybody on
for the county, but I think everybody on the panel will say the same thing. It's
the panel will say the same thing. It's
the panel will say the same thing. It's it's it's really put a pressure on how
it's it's really put a pressure on how
it's it's really put a pressure on how we do business. And uh from our
we do business. And uh from our
we do business. And uh from our perspective,
perspective,
perspective, you know, you you look at it and you
you know, you you look at it and you
you know, you you look at it and you think and this is this is all that you
think and this is this is all that you
think and this is this is all that you can you can find through the Department
can you can find through the Department
can you can find through the Department of Revenue Administration or you can
of Revenue Administration or you can
of Revenue Administration or you can find through the New Hampshire uh fiscal
find through the New Hampshire uh fiscal
find through the New Hampshire uh fiscal policy institute and it's it's about
policy institute and it's it's about
policy institute and it's it's about cost shifting of of over three billion
cost shifting of of over three billion
cost shifting of of over three billion dollars down to the to all of us.
dollars down to the to all of us.
dollars down to the to all of us. And we've only increased taxes during
And we've only increased taxes during
And we've only increased taxes during that uh time or levy taxes at that at
that uh time or levy taxes at that at
that uh time or levy taxes at that at that time at 1.2 28 billion. Had we
that time at 1.2 28 billion. Had we
that time at 1.2 28 billion. Had we received the funding,
received the funding,
received the funding, we'd actually be in a very different
we'd actually be in a very different
we'd actually be in a very different scenario. But over time, that's been
scenario. But over time, that's been
scenario. But over time, that's been taken away. And the easiest example,
taken away. And the easiest example,
taken away. And the easiest example, because you're going to hear about
because you're going to hear about
because you're going to hear about multiple ways tonight, the easiest
multiple ways tonight, the easiest
multiple ways tonight, the easiest example is the pension fund. There was
example is the pension fund. There was
example is the pension fund. There was four different pensions
four different pensions
four different pensions at one point, and they said, "We would
at one point, and they said, "We would
at one point, and they said, "We would like to have one single pension."
like to have one single pension."
like to have one single pension." And if the new New Hampshire retirement
And if the new New Hampshire retirement
And if the new New Hampshire retirement system was born and at the time they
system was born and at the time they
system was born and at the time they said we're going to pay 35%
said we're going to pay 35%
said we're going to pay 35% for teachers actually it was 40% and in
for teachers actually it was 40% and in
for teachers actually it was 40% and in 1977 they lowered it down to 35%. And
1977 they lowered it down to 35%. And
1977 they lowered it down to 35%. And then over time what we saw is that they
then over time what we saw is that they
then over time what we saw is that they in 20 I think it's 2011 and I it that
in 20 I think it's 2011 and I it that
in 20 I think it's 2011 and I it that they they decided to lower it down to 20
they they decided to lower it down to 20
they they decided to lower it down to 20 25% and then in 2015 they got rid of it
25% and then in 2015 they got rid of it
25% and then in 2015 they got rid of it zero increase. Do you know what that
zero increase. Do you know what that
zero increase. Do you know what that means to the city of Keen alone? Think
means to the city of Keen alone? Think
means to the city of Keen alone? Think about that. The the whether you know it
about that. The the whether you know it
about that. The the whether you know it it is a promise that was broken. And so
it is a promise that was broken. And so
it is a promise that was broken. And so you have the county in that mix, you
you have the county in that mix, you
you have the county in that mix, you have the school district in that mix,
have the school district in that mix,
have the school district in that mix, and you have the city of Keen in that
and you have the city of Keen in that
and you have the city of Keen in that mix. That was over it in my how I look
mix. That was over it in my how I look
mix. That was over it in my how I look at it close to $2 million forever burden
at it close to $2 million forever burden
at it close to $2 million forever burden that you we had to take on because they
that you we had to take on because they
that you we had to take on because they made a decision to walk away from
made a decision to walk away from
made a decision to walk away from something that they had agreed to do. So
something that they had agreed to do. So
something that they had agreed to do. So today, that's you're going to hear more
today, that's you're going to hear more
today, that's you're going to hear more and more about these broken promises.
and more about these broken promises.
and more about these broken promises. And I'll let others because I have a
And I'll let others because I have a
And I'll let others because I have a litany of lists in here of things that
litany of lists in here of things that
litany of lists in here of things that they have done, but I'm gonna let others
they have done, but I'm gonna let others
they have done, but I'm gonna let others attempt to explain that too. And I I
attempt to explain that too. And I I
attempt to explain that too. And I I thought if it's all right, um if if it's
thought if it's all right, um if if it's
thought if it's all right, um if if it's Margaret, if you could just chime in um
Margaret, if you could just chime in um
Margaret, if you could just chime in um and just give a little bit of history
and just give a little bit of history
and just give a little bit of history too from your perspective.
>> Well, thank you Chris and thank you
>> Well, thank you Chris and thank you everyone for being here tonight and
everyone for being here tonight and
everyone for being here tonight and including me on this panel. Um, I I echo
including me on this panel. Um, I I echo
including me on this panel. Um, I I echo everything Chris said and want to give
everything Chris said and want to give
everything Chris said and want to give sort of an even broader look at where we
sort of an even broader look at where we
sort of an even broader look at where we are. So, if if I'm thinking about the
are. So, if if I'm thinking about the
are. So, if if I'm thinking about the question of how we got here, it's sort
question of how we got here, it's sort
question of how we got here, it's sort of two parts for me. On the one hand,
of two parts for me. On the one hand,
of two parts for me. On the one hand, it's a system that relies heavily on
it's a system that relies heavily on
it's a system that relies heavily on local property taxes to fund budgets
local property taxes to fund budgets
local property taxes to fund budgets locally. And I think that's a really
locally. And I think that's a really
locally. And I think that's a really important thing to understand. And I
important thing to understand. And I
important thing to understand. And I think some of the questions and
think some of the questions and
think some of the questions and discussion that we have later on this
discussion that we have later on this
discussion that we have later on this evening will talk a little bit more
evening will talk a little bit more
evening will talk a little bit more about that. But New Hampshire is a state
about that. But New Hampshire is a state
about that. But New Hampshire is a state that per our system, per our statutes,
that per our system, per our statutes,
that per our system, per our statutes, we rely heavily on property taxes at the
we rely heavily on property taxes at the
we rely heavily on property taxes at the local level. Meaning municipalities are
local level. Meaning municipalities are
local level. Meaning municipalities are restricted in what they can raise
restricted in what they can raise
restricted in what they can raise locally other than property taxes to
locally other than property taxes to
locally other than property taxes to fund local expense uh expenses. And the
fund local expense uh expenses. And the
fund local expense uh expenses. And the other piece of it is sort of a history
other piece of it is sort of a history
other piece of it is sort of a history of what's been referred to as cost
of what's been referred to as cost
of what's been referred to as cost shifting, sometimes referred to as
shifting, sometimes referred to as
shifting, sometimes referred to as downshifting, and some of which Chris
downshifting, and some of which Chris
downshifting, and some of which Chris has already referenced, where um aid
has already referenced, where um aid
has already referenced, where um aid that was given to the state by the state
that was given to the state by the state
that was given to the state by the state to municipalities or revenue that was
to municipalities or revenue that was
to municipalities or revenue that was previously shared between the state and
previously shared between the state and
previously shared between the state and municipalities has either been done away
municipalities has either been done away
municipalities has either been done away with or cut significantly. Right? And so
with or cut significantly. Right? And so
with or cut significantly. Right? And so when you have a revenue stream and then
when you have a revenue stream and then
when you have a revenue stream and then it's cut or it's cut down, that's going
it's cut or it's cut down, that's going
it's cut or it's cut down, that's going to impact what you're able to do locally
to impact what you're able to do locally
to impact what you're able to do locally or it's going to impact what you have to
or it's going to impact what you have to
or it's going to impact what you have to raise locally for property taxes. So
raise locally for property taxes. So
raise locally for property taxes. So really what we saw was in the aftermath
really what we saw was in the aftermath
really what we saw was in the aftermath of the great recess recession. So sort
of the great recess recession. So sort
of the great recess recession. So sort of in the 2010 2011 legislative session,
of in the 2010 2011 legislative session,
of in the 2010 2011 legislative session, we started to see some of the
we started to see some of the
we started to see some of the substantial changes that are compounding
substantial changes that are compounding
substantial changes that are compounding and have been compounding up until now
and have been compounding up until now
and have been compounding up until now and will continue to do so unless there
and will continue to do so unless there
and will continue to do so unless there are changes made. So those big big cuts
are changes made. So those big big cuts
are changes made. So those big big cuts or big changes are going to include what
or big changes are going to include what
or big changes are going to include what Chris mentioned, the state's
Chris mentioned, the state's
Chris mentioned, the state's contribution to local retirement system
contribution to local retirement system
contribution to local retirement system costs. So for police, fire, and
costs. So for police, fire, and
costs. So for police, fire, and teachers, it used to be that the state
teachers, it used to be that the state
teachers, it used to be that the state statutoily provided 40% of that to
statutoily provided 40% of that to
statutoily provided 40% of that to political subdivisions as a way to
political subdivisions as a way to
political subdivisions as a way to offset local costs to pay towards the
offset local costs to pay towards the
offset local costs to pay towards the pension. And that was part of sort of a
pension. And that was part of sort of a
pension. And that was part of sort of a deal that the state and municipalities
deal that the state and municipalities
deal that the state and municipalities struck many years ago. It used to be the
struck many years ago. It used to be the
struck many years ago. It used to be the case that cities and towns had local
case that cities and towns had local
case that cities and towns had local pensions and the state had a desire to
pensions and the state had a desire to
pensions and the state had a desire to consolidate and there were benefits to
consolidate and there were benefits to
consolidate and there were benefits to consolidating and having one system
consolidating and having one system
consolidating and having one system across the state but sort of the quidd
across the state but sort of the quidd
across the state but sort of the quidd proquo was you'll consolidate with us
proquo was you'll consolidate with us
proquo was you'll consolidate with us and the state will contribute a share
and the state will contribute a share
and the state will contribute a share towards the positions locally that are
towards the positions locally that are
towards the positions locally that are required to be part of the New Hampshire
required to be part of the New Hampshire
required to be part of the New Hampshire retirement system. So we used to see a
retirement system. So we used to see a
retirement system. So we used to see a state share of that cost locally and in
state share of that cost locally and in
state share of that cost locally and in the aftermath of the great recession we
the aftermath of the great recession we
the aftermath of the great recession we saw it cut and then entirely repealed.
saw it cut and then entirely repealed.
saw it cut and then entirely repealed. So it went from 40 to 35% and then
So it went from 40 to 35% and then
So it went from 40 to 35% and then ultimately it went down to 0% and it's
ultimately it went down to 0% and it's
ultimately it went down to 0% and it's now been a decade and a half since we've
now been a decade and a half since we've
now been a decade and a half since we've seen that revenue come back to cities
seen that revenue come back to cities
seen that revenue come back to cities and towns. We've seen changes in the
and towns. We've seen changes in the
and towns. We've seen changes in the distribution of the municipal share of
distribution of the municipal share of
distribution of the municipal share of the meals and rooms tax or the meals and
the meals and rooms tax or the meals and
the meals and rooms tax or the meals and rentals tax. So you're probably familiar
rentals tax. So you're probably familiar
rentals tax. So you're probably familiar with the meals and rentals tax. You see
with the meals and rentals tax. You see
with the meals and rentals tax. You see that 8 and a half% on your restaurant
that 8 and a half% on your restaurant
that 8 and a half% on your restaurant bill or your hotel bill. Used to be 9%
bill or your hotel bill. Used to be 9%
bill or your hotel bill. Used to be 9% but it was cut in the last few years to
but it was cut in the last few years to
but it was cut in the last few years to 8.5%. So municipalities were supposed to
8.5%. So municipalities were supposed to
8.5%. So municipalities were supposed to share 40% of that revenue that came into
share 40% of that revenue that came into
share 40% of that revenue that came into the state. There's a rationale for that.
the state. There's a rationale for that.
the state. There's a rationale for that. cities and towns bear essentially an
cities and towns bear essentially an
cities and towns bear essentially an equal burden of the tourism that comes
equal burden of the tourism that comes
equal burden of the tourism that comes into our state. So the idea was that
into our state. So the idea was that
into our state. So the idea was that they should also share in the revenue
they should also share in the revenue
they should also share in the revenue and the benefits of tourism that comes
and the benefits of tourism that comes
and the benefits of tourism that comes into our state. But what we saw in that
into our state. But what we saw in that
into our state. But what we saw in that in really even before the great
in really even before the great
in really even before the great recession but continuing afterwards was
recession but continuing afterwards was
recession but continuing afterwards was cuts to the municipal share as well as
cuts to the municipal share as well as
cuts to the municipal share as well as level funding of the municipal share. So
level funding of the municipal share. So
level funding of the municipal share. So rather than providing a percentage as
rather than providing a percentage as
rather than providing a percentage as the municipal share, level funding it
the municipal share, level funding it
the municipal share, level funding it yeartoyear so that municipalities didn't
yeartoyear so that municipalities didn't
yeartoyear so that municipalities didn't get the benefit of any increases that
get the benefit of any increases that
get the benefit of any increases that were being brought in to the meals and
were being brought in to the meals and
were being brought in to the meals and rooms tax. We saw a catch-up formula
rooms tax. We saw a catch-up formula
rooms tax. We saw a catch-up formula implemented that was meant to catch
implemented that was meant to catch
implemented that was meant to catch municipalities back up that was then
municipalities back up that was then
municipalities back up that was then suspended um in the years to follow. And
suspended um in the years to follow. And
suspended um in the years to follow. And only in in 2021 did we see a substantial
only in in 2021 did we see a substantial
only in in 2021 did we see a substantial change to the law that did at least
change to the law that did at least
change to the law that did at least bring municipalities to 30% share of the
bring municipalities to 30% share of the
bring municipalities to 30% share of the meals and rooms tax which has been very
meals and rooms tax which has been very
meals and rooms tax which has been very positive but of course we've never gone
positive but of course we've never gone
positive but of course we've never gone back to where we originally were at the
back to where we originally were at the
back to where we originally were at the at the 40%. Um other changes would be
at the 40%. Um other changes would be
at the 40%. Um other changes would be that there used to be a statute that
that there used to be a statute that
that there used to be a statute that allowed or required for municipalities
allowed or required for municipalities
allowed or required for municipalities to share in general fund revenue. So
to share in general fund revenue. So
to share in general fund revenue. So this means that municipalities were
this means that municipalities were
this means that municipalities were supposed to get a share of the general
supposed to get a share of the general
supposed to get a share of the general unrestricted funds of the state. That
unrestricted funds of the state. That
unrestricted funds of the state. That statute was suspended for over a decade
statute was suspended for over a decade
statute was suspended for over a decade before it was repealed this past bianium
before it was repealed this past bianium
before it was repealed this past bianium at the legislature. And we've also seen
at the legislature. And we've also seen
at the legislature. And we've also seen other sort of unreliable ups and downs
other sort of unreliable ups and downs
other sort of unreliable ups and downs in streams of revenue from the state
in streams of revenue from the state
in streams of revenue from the state such as for pro things like um uh sewer
such as for pro things like um uh sewer
such as for pro things like um uh sewer projects for the state aid grants that
projects for the state aid grants that
projects for the state aid grants that help fund some of those bigger
help fund some of those bigger
help fund some of those bigger infrastructure costs. So, we're really
infrastructure costs. So, we're really
infrastructure costs. So, we're really looking at many years, well more than a
looking at many years, well more than a
looking at many years, well more than a decade of cuts and changes to state aid
decade of cuts and changes to state aid
decade of cuts and changes to state aid to cities and towns. And then I think
to cities and towns. And then I think
to cities and towns. And then I think it's a it's a clear line if you think
it's a it's a clear line if you think
it's a it's a clear line if you think about it from uh from that to where
about it from uh from that to where
about it from uh from that to where municipalities need to come up with more
municipalities need to come up with more
municipalities need to come up with more funding in order to continue to pay the
funding in order to continue to pay the
funding in order to continue to pay the local costs that they have.
>> Well, we'll keep going. So, thank you
>> Well, we'll keep going. So, thank you for that. I think that laid out kind of
for that. I think that laid out kind of
for that. I think that laid out kind of how we got to this situation and where
how we got to this situation and where
how we got to this situation and where we're at. And we talked a lot about cost
we're at. And we talked a lot about cost
we're at. And we talked a lot about cost downshifting and what downshifting
downshifting and what downshifting
downshifting and what downshifting actually means. I want to move on to our
actually means. I want to move on to our
actually means. I want to move on to our municipal manager. You know, as your
municipal manager. You know, as your
municipal manager. You know, as your perspective as a as a city manager, how
perspective as a as a city manager, how
perspective as a as a city manager, how do you define this cost downshifting in
do you define this cost downshifting in
do you define this cost downshifting in New Hampshire and what are the most
New Hampshire and what are the most
New Hampshire and what are the most significant examples we're seeing today?
significant examples we're seeing today?
significant examples we're seeing today? Yeah. So Chris and Margaret both touched
Yeah. So Chris and Margaret both touched
Yeah. So Chris and Margaret both touched on uh several of the items I'm going to
on uh several of the items I'm going to
on uh several of the items I'm going to speak about, but cost shifting has
speak about, but cost shifting has
speak about, but cost shifting has really not been one thing. It's been one
really not been one thing. It's been one
really not been one thing. It's been one thing after another. Small changes over
thing after another. Small changes over
thing after another. Small changes over a long period of time. And I would say
a long period of time. And I would say
a long period of time. And I would say that the promises that were made back in
that the promises that were made back in
that the promises that were made back in the 60s and 70s, we started to see those
the 60s and 70s, we started to see those
the 60s and 70s, we started to see those promises erode away like Margaret was
promises erode away like Margaret was
promises erode away like Margaret was saying after 20 uh 2008. Um and it was
saying after 20 uh 2008. Um and it was
saying after 20 uh 2008. Um and it was one small change or one freeze freezing
one small change or one freeze freezing
one small change or one freeze freezing of a revenue source and and and until
of a revenue source and and and until
of a revenue source and and and until they eliminated several things. And so
they eliminated several things. And so
they eliminated several things. And so it's really a bunch of different actions
it's really a bunch of different actions
it's really a bunch of different actions over a period of time. And it's when the
over a period of time. And it's when the
over a period of time. And it's when the state decides to reduce or eliminate a
state decides to reduce or eliminate a
state decides to reduce or eliminate a revenue that we are receiving receiving
revenue that we are receiving receiving
revenue that we are receiving receiving or if they are requiring us to do
or if they are requiring us to do
or if they are requiring us to do something at the local level without a
something at the local level without a
something at the local level without a funding source um to do it or if they're
funding source um to do it or if they're
funding source um to do it or if they're um shifting shared systems such as
um shifting shared systems such as
um shifting shared systems such as education, transportation, public
education, transportation, public
education, transportation, public health, and human services more to the
health, and human services more to the
health, and human services more to the local level. That's also downshifting.
local level. That's also downshifting.
local level. That's also downshifting. And we're seeing a lot of that right now
And we're seeing a lot of that right now
And we're seeing a lot of that right now at the education level in terms of
at the education level in terms of
at the education level in terms of funding of education and the state not
funding of education and the state not
funding of education and the state not holding up their end of the bargain. And
holding up their end of the bargain. And
holding up their end of the bargain. And we'll talk more about that. And then
we'll talk more about that. And then
we'll talk more about that. And then it's just um expecting us to maintain
it's just um expecting us to maintain
it's just um expecting us to maintain and continue to do the same work we're
and continue to do the same work we're
and continue to do the same work we're doing with less money. Um and so that's
doing with less money. Um and so that's
doing with less money. Um and so that's really uh what how I defined uh
really uh what how I defined uh
really uh what how I defined uh downshifting. We have some real examples
downshifting. We have some real examples
downshifting. We have some real examples here and I tried to pull a few numbers
here and I tried to pull a few numbers
here and I tried to pull a few numbers for you. Retirement as they were
for you. Retirement as they were
for you. Retirement as they were mentioning uh the New Hampshire
mentioning uh the New Hampshire
mentioning uh the New Hampshire retirement system was created uh for
retirement system was created uh for
retirement system was created uh for statewide system for this
statewide system for this
statewide system for this municipalities, the county, the school,
municipalities, the county, the school,
municipalities, the county, the school, the police, and the fire employees
the police, and the fire employees
the police, and the fire employees through pulled contributions. And I want
through pulled contributions. And I want
through pulled contributions. And I want everyone to understand that once we
everyone to understand that once we
everyone to understand that once we signed on to that, we now have members
signed on to that, we now have members
signed on to that, we now have members of the retirement system who are
of the retirement system who are
of the retirement system who are expecting benefits from that retirement
expecting benefits from that retirement
expecting benefits from that retirement system. It's not and we are required to
system. It's not and we are required to
system. It's not and we are required to continue to contribute to that
continue to contribute to that
continue to contribute to that retirement system. Even though they are
retirement system. Even though they are
retirement system. Even though they are not keeping up their end of the bargain,
not keeping up their end of the bargain,
not keeping up their end of the bargain, they're not giving us another option. We
they're not giving us another option. We
they're not giving us another option. We still need to fund that retirement
still need to fund that retirement
still need to fund that retirement system. And so that has been one of the
system. And so that has been one of the
system. And so that has been one of the significant changes that we've seen. And
significant changes that we've seen. And
significant changes that we've seen. And so today, Keen pays approximately 3
so today, Keen pays approximately 3
so today, Keen pays approximately 3 million annually for police and fire
million annually for police and fire
million annually for police and fire retirement. And 35%, which is what the
retirement. And 35%, which is what the
retirement. And 35%, which is what the state was paying, is roughly um $1.04
state was paying, is roughly um $1.04
state was paying, is roughly um $1.04 million a year. That is a direct shift
million a year. That is a direct shift
million a year. That is a direct shift of a million dollars um to the local
of a million dollars um to the local
of a million dollars um to the local taxpayers without another option in
taxpayers without another option in
taxpayers without another option in terms of funding our retirement account.
terms of funding our retirement account.
terms of funding our retirement account. So that's approximately 45 cents on your
So that's approximately 45 cents on your
So that's approximately 45 cents on your tax rate uh per year. It's probably
tax rate uh per year. It's probably
tax rate uh per year. It's probably about $13 million year to date that they
about $13 million year to date that they
about $13 million year to date that they haven't paid to us. And I understand why
haven't paid to us. And I understand why
haven't paid to us. And I understand why it happened. They were struggling um to
it happened. They were struggling um to
it happened. They were struggling um to to balance their budgets and they were
to balance their budgets and they were
to balance their budgets and they were looking for ways to reduce their
looking for ways to reduce their
looking for ways to reduce their expenses. Unfortunately, they did it on
expenses. Unfortunately, they did it on
expenses. Unfortunately, they did it on all of our backs and it became our
all of our backs and it became our
all of our backs and it became our problem at the local level. The other
problem at the local level. The other
problem at the local level. The other thing and Margaret was talking about
thing and Margaret was talking about
thing and Margaret was talking about this is the meals and rooms
this is the meals and rooms
this is the meals and rooms distribution. So that was enacted in
distribution. So that was enacted in
distribution. So that was enacted in 1967 as a statewide tax to tourism and
1967 as a statewide tax to tourism and
1967 as a statewide tax to tourism and economic activity and municipalities
economic activity and municipalities
economic activity and municipalities were supposed to be sharing um 40% of
were supposed to be sharing um 40% of
were supposed to be sharing um 40% of that because we are providing roads and
that because we are providing roads and
that because we are providing roads and infrastructure, police, fire protection,
infrastructure, police, fire protection,
infrastructure, police, fire protection, utilities and all the services that
utilities and all the services that
utilities and all the services that support tourism and economic
support tourism and economic
support tourism and economic development. So the intent was to share
development. So the intent was to share
development. So the intent was to share 40%. But that actually stopped earlier
40%. But that actually stopped earlier
40%. But that actually stopped earlier than the 2080 uh two uh 2008 timeline.
than the 2080 uh two uh 2008 timeline.
than the 2080 uh two uh 2008 timeline. Um actually it started back in 1977
Um actually it started back in 1977
Um actually it started back in 1977 again in 1981. And it wasn't until 1993
again in 1981. And it wasn't until 1993
again in 1981. And it wasn't until 1993 when a formula was created to catch up
when a formula was created to catch up
when a formula was created to catch up towns to get them to 40%. And we all
towns to get them to 40%. And we all
towns to get them to 40%. And we all thought oh finally we're going to get to
thought oh finally we're going to get to
thought oh finally we're going to get to 40%. That did not happen. We are at 30%
40%. That did not happen. We are at 30%
40%. That did not happen. We are at 30% right now. Um because that formula
right now. Um because that formula
right now. Um because that formula changed again. But what does that mean
changed again. But what does that mean
changed again. But what does that mean to us here in the city of Keen? Well,
to us here in the city of Keen? Well,
to us here in the city of Keen? Well, for Keen, that roughly represents
for Keen, that roughly represents
for Keen, that roughly represents $700,000 a year. Um that's 30 cents on
$700,000 a year. Um that's 30 cents on
$700,000 a year. Um that's 30 cents on your tax rate. Um and year-to- date,
your tax rate. Um and year-to- date,
your tax rate. Um and year-to- date, it's really hard to estimate because the
it's really hard to estimate because the
it's really hard to estimate because the numbers that we were collecting
numbers that we were collecting
numbers that we were collecting throughout the state differed and there
throughout the state differed and there
throughout the state differed and there was different rates. But even if at
was different rates. But even if at
was different rates. But even if at 700,000 all the way back 30 years,
700,000 all the way back 30 years,
700,000 all the way back 30 years, you're you're at least talking 20 to30
you're you're at least talking 20 to30
you're you're at least talking 20 to30 million dollars that they have not paid
million dollars that they have not paid
million dollars that they have not paid to the city of Keen for meals and rooms
to the city of Keen for meals and rooms
to the city of Keen for meals and rooms distribution.
distribution.
distribution. Then we had revenue sharing and that was
Then we had revenue sharing and that was
Then we had revenue sharing and that was this broader revenue sharing program
this broader revenue sharing program
this broader revenue sharing program that they created back in 1969 to return
that they created back in 1969 to return
that they created back in 1969 to return a portion of the state revenues back to
a portion of the state revenues back to
a portion of the state revenues back to municipalities. And it wasn't just out
municipalities. And it wasn't just out
municipalities. And it wasn't just out of the goodness of their hearts. It was
of the goodness of their hearts. It was
of the goodness of their hearts. It was because we were taxing back then
because we were taxing back then
because we were taxing back then agriculture
agriculture
agriculture um go goats and sheep and all sorts of
um go goats and sheep and all sorts of
um go goats and sheep and all sorts of things. And instead of us municipalities
things. And instead of us municipalities
things. And instead of us municipalities taxing that property, the state wanted a
taxing that property, the state wanted a
taxing that property, the state wanted a different system and they created this
different system and they created this
different system and they created this business profit tax system and they
business profit tax system and they
business profit tax system and they said, "Look, we know we are now taking
said, "Look, we know we are now taking
said, "Look, we know we are now taking this away from you and we need to give
this away from you and we need to give
this away from you and we need to give the towns and cities something back and
the towns and cities something back and
the towns and cities something back and so we're going to share revenue with
so we're going to share revenue with
so we're going to share revenue with you." And that was the business profit
you." And that was the business profit
you." And that was the business profit the revenue sharing program. Um,
the revenue sharing program. Um,
the revenue sharing program. Um, unfortunately they did uh freeze that
unfortunately they did uh freeze that
unfortunately they did uh freeze that for a little while and then they totally
for a little while and then they totally
for a little while and then they totally eliminated it and it was eliminated back
eliminated it and it was eliminated back
eliminated it and it was eliminated back in 2009. Before that we were we were
in 2009. Before that we were we were
in 2009. Before that we were we were receiving $992,000
receiving $992,000
receiving $992,000 a year. That's again almost another
a year. That's again almost another
a year. That's again almost another million annually. A another 40 cent
million annually. A another 40 cent
million annually. A another 40 cent impact on your tax rate. Just those
impact on your tax rate. Just those
impact on your tax rate. Just those three examples. And there are lots more
three examples. And there are lots more
three examples. And there are lots more smaller examples. Those are the larger
smaller examples. Those are the larger
smaller examples. Those are the larger ones for towns and cities. But um there
ones for towns and cities. But um there
ones for towns and cities. But um there are it when they decide not to fund
are it when they decide not to fund
are it when they decide not to fund bridge aid and you have redlisted
bridge aid and you have redlisted
bridge aid and you have redlisted bridges in your community that need to
bridges in your community that need to
bridges in your community that need to be fixed. When they decide not to fund
be fixed. When they decide not to fund
be fixed. When they decide not to fund the road program and you have a road
the road program and you have a road
the road program and you have a road project in the 10-year plan that has now
project in the 10-year plan that has now
project in the 10-year plan that has now become a 15-year plan because they're
become a 15-year plan because they're
become a 15-year plan because they're not funding it at the level that they
not funding it at the level that they
not funding it at the level that they that they should be. All of those things
that they should be. All of those things
that they should be. All of those things add up and it just adds up to this
add up and it just adds up to this
add up and it just adds up to this continued strain on the local tax rate.
continued strain on the local tax rate.
continued strain on the local tax rate. >> Well, thank you for Elizabeth for that
>> Well, thank you for Elizabeth for that
>> Well, thank you for Elizabeth for that question. Before we continue, we have
question. Before we continue, we have
question. Before we continue, we have note cards that we are going to hand
note cards that we are going to hand
note cards that we are going to hand out. Um, we were able to get those. So,
out. Um, we were able to get those. So,
out. Um, we were able to get those. So, write a question if you have at the end
write a question if you have at the end
write a question if you have at the end of the at the end of this. We're going
of the at the end of this. We're going
of the at the end of this. We're going to collect them and answer those for
to collect them and answer those for
to collect them and answer those for you. Gonna keep you in the hot seat for
you. Gonna keep you in the hot seat for
you. Gonna keep you in the hot seat for a second.
a second.
a second. >> Okay. Um, I just want to ask, you know,
>> Okay. Um, I just want to ask, you know,
>> Okay. Um, I just want to ask, you know, how does this impact your ability to
how does this impact your ability to
how does this impact your ability to plan long term, especially when we're
plan long term, especially when we're
plan long term, especially when we're talking about capital projects and
talking about capital projects and
talking about capital projects and things like that? And are we being
things like that? And are we being
things like that? And are we being forced to make tradeoffs? Are
forced to make tradeoffs? Are
forced to make tradeoffs? Are municipalities cutting services? Are we
municipalities cutting services? Are we
municipalities cutting services? Are we delaying investments or both? And, you
delaying investments or both? And, you
delaying investments or both? And, you know, answer a little bit. I'd like to
know, answer a little bit. I'd like to
know, answer a little bit. I'd like to hear from the other panelists as well on
hear from the other panelists as well on
hear from the other panelists as well on that.
that.
that. >> Sure.
>> Sure.
>> Sure. >> So, the answer to that question is
>> So, the answer to that question is
>> So, the answer to that question is twofold. Um, one, if we're not able to
twofold. Um, one, if we're not able to
twofold. Um, one, if we're not able to rely on the revenue yeartoear, it's hard
rely on the revenue yeartoear, it's hard
rely on the revenue yeartoear, it's hard to plan on that. um and how much we will
to plan on that. um and how much we will
to plan on that. um and how much we will actually be able to collect. But I want
actually be able to collect. But I want
actually be able to collect. But I want to give you just a current reall life
to give you just a current reall life
to give you just a current reall life example. Um I talked a little bit about
example. Um I talked a little bit about
example. Um I talked a little bit about the highway funding and the bridge
the highway funding and the bridge
the highway funding and the bridge funding. Well, as the statewide funding
funding. Well, as the statewide funding
funding. Well, as the statewide funding becomes more constrained, capital
becomes more constrained, capital
becomes more constrained, capital projects are delayed and on waiting list
projects are delayed and on waiting list
projects are delayed and on waiting list and those waiting lists grow at the New
and those waiting lists grow at the New
and those waiting lists grow at the New Hampshire state level as they continue
Hampshire state level as they continue
Hampshire state level as they continue to not fund those those plans
to not fund those those plans
to not fund those those plans appropriately. In Keen, it's had some
appropriately. In Keen, it's had some
appropriately. In Keen, it's had some real operational impacts. So for
real operational impacts. So for
real operational impacts. So for example, weight restrictions on bridges
example, weight restrictions on bridges
example, weight restrictions on bridges that affect truck traffic, school buses,
that affect truck traffic, school buses,
that affect truck traffic, school buses, and emergency responses while we wait
and emergency responses while we wait
and emergency responses while we wait for funding. That happened this year. So
for funding. That happened this year. So
for funding. That happened this year. So in Keen, we have 10 municipallyowned
in Keen, we have 10 municipallyowned
in Keen, we have 10 municipallyowned redlisted bridges. And what that means
redlisted bridges. And what that means
redlisted bridges. And what that means is those bridges are in desperate need
is those bridges are in desperate need
is those bridges are in desperate need of repair. And you're on a list. There's
of repair. And you're on a list. There's
of repair. And you're on a list. There's a statewide list for bridges. And
a statewide list for bridges. And
a statewide list for bridges. And there's more than 200 statewide bridges
there's more than 200 statewide bridges
there's more than 200 statewide bridges on this red list. In late 2025, the city
on this red list. In late 2025, the city
on this red list. In late 2025, the city had to impose a 10-tonon weight
had to impose a 10-tonon weight
had to impose a 10-tonon weight restriction on the Spring Street and
restriction on the Spring Street and
restriction on the Spring Street and Beaver Street bridges. This has impacted
Beaver Street bridges. This has impacted
Beaver Street bridges. This has impacted delivery trucks, fuel trucks, school
delivery trucks, fuel trucks, school
delivery trucks, fuel trucks, school buses, and heavy emergency apparatus.
buses, and heavy emergency apparatus.
buses, and heavy emergency apparatus. So, these are real impacts when these um
So, these are real impacts when these um
So, these are real impacts when these um infrastructures uh these projects, these
infrastructures uh these projects, these
infrastructures uh these projects, these bridges are not funded and they are real
bridges are not funded and they are real
bridges are not funded and they are real consequences to the local community.
consequences to the local community.
consequences to the local community. >> Thank you for that. Um, Rob, you look
>> Thank you for that. Um, Rob, you look
>> Thank you for that. Um, Rob, you look lonely down there. So, we're going to
lonely down there. So, we're going to
lonely down there. So, we're going to move into school funding for you. And I
move into school funding for you. And I
move into school funding for you. And I just want you to share a couple examples
just want you to share a couple examples
just want you to share a couple examples of how state cost shifts or funding gaps
of how state cost shifts or funding gaps
of how state cost shifts or funding gaps are impacting school budgets.
are impacting school budgets.
are impacting school budgets. >> Well, thank you, Senator Fenton. Um, I
>> Well, thank you, Senator Fenton. Um, I
>> Well, thank you, Senator Fenton. Um, I think we've heard about the retirement
think we've heard about the retirement
think we've heard about the retirement contributions being downshifted. So, for
contributions being downshifted. So, for
contributions being downshifted. So, for next fiscal year, for our next operating
next fiscal year, for our next operating
next fiscal year, for our next operating year, that would actually translate into
year, that would actually translate into
year, that would actually translate into us needing to raise an additional 1.8 8
us needing to raise an additional 1.8 8
us needing to raise an additional 1.8 8 now that it is no longer being funded at
now that it is no longer being funded at
now that it is no longer being funded at the state level, that 35% you heard my
the state level, that 35% you heard my
the state level, that 35% you heard my colleagues already talk about, you know,
colleagues already talk about, you know,
colleagues already talk about, you know, we now have to raise an additional $1.8
we now have to raise an additional $1.8
we now have to raise an additional $1.8 million to meet that obligation for our
million to meet that obligation for our
million to meet that obligation for our employees. Um, you know, had we
employees. Um, you know, had we
employees. Um, you know, had we continued to receive that 35% that would
continued to receive that 35% that would
continued to receive that 35% that would be almost $2 million, our budget would
be almost $2 million, our budget would
be almost $2 million, our budget would be down, but it's not. And so we've got
be down, but it's not. And so we've got
be down, but it's not. And so we've got to we've got to absorb that cost and
to we've got to absorb that cost and
to we've got to absorb that cost and we've got to provide that benefit for
we've got to provide that benefit for
we've got to provide that benefit for the people that we hire and that we work
the people that we hire and that we work
the people that we hire and that we work with. Um some of the additional examples
with. Um some of the additional examples
with. Um some of the additional examples that I would kind of highlight, I guess
that I would kind of highlight, I guess
that I would kind of highlight, I guess special education, that's probably one
special education, that's probably one
special education, that's probably one that a lot of folks are familiar with.
that a lot of folks are familiar with.
that a lot of folks are familiar with. There at one time was a really solid
There at one time was a really solid
There at one time was a really solid structure in place that would reimburse
structure in place that would reimburse
structure in place that would reimburse districts for exorbitant costs for
districts for exorbitant costs for
districts for exorbitant costs for special education. Um it was called
special education. Um it was called
special education. Um it was called catastrophic aid. It's now called
catastrophic aid. It's now called
catastrophic aid. It's now called special education aid. And at one time
special education aid. And at one time
special education aid. And at one time we were getting 80% once we hit a
we were getting 80% once we hit a
we were getting 80% once we hit a certain threshold above the um cost per
certain threshold above the um cost per
certain threshold above the um cost per pupil we would get reimbured 80% of that
pupil we would get reimbured 80% of that
pupil we would get reimbured 80% of that those costs.
those costs.
those costs. Now that 80%
Now that 80%
Now that 80% if we're lucky, we're seeing 67 68 cents
if we're lucky, we're seeing 67 68 cents
if we're lucky, we're seeing 67 68 cents to the dollar. So that has significantly
to the dollar. So that has significantly
to the dollar. So that has significantly reduced those reimbursements which go to
reduced those reimbursements which go to
reduced those reimbursements which go to the future year's revenue which allows
the future year's revenue which allows
the future year's revenue which allows us to not have to raise as much money
us to not have to raise as much money
us to not have to raise as much money for taxation through taxation. Um those
for taxation through taxation. Um those
for taxation through taxation. Um those two really jump out to me as um some of
two really jump out to me as um some of
two really jump out to me as um some of the leading drivers for education. But
the leading drivers for education. But
the leading drivers for education. But by and large, our public schools are
by and large, our public schools are
by and large, our public schools are some of the most regulated structures we
some of the most regulated structures we
some of the most regulated structures we have in the state. We have to hire
have in the state. We have to hire
have in the state. We have to hire personnel with specific credentials. We
personnel with specific credentials. We
personnel with specific credentials. We have to provide transportation from home
have to provide transportation from home
have to provide transportation from home to school, back to home. Um
to school, back to home. Um
to school, back to home. Um those things aren't reimbursed, at least
those things aren't reimbursed, at least
those things aren't reimbursed, at least not in a at a rate that would we would
not in a at a rate that would we would
not in a at a rate that would we would see. you know, we're required to provide
see. you know, we're required to provide
see. you know, we're required to provide the transportation, but we yet we don't
the transportation, but we yet we don't
the transportation, but we yet we don't receive funding to meet that
receive funding to meet that
receive funding to meet that requirement. So, I think my colleague
requirement. So, I think my colleague
requirement. So, I think my colleague from the city um had referred to it,
from the city um had referred to it,
from the city um had referred to it, well, we call it unfunded mandates. You
well, we call it unfunded mandates. You
well, we call it unfunded mandates. You know, when you have these mandates that
know, when you have these mandates that
know, when you have these mandates that you have to provide and the service that
you have to provide and the service that
you have to provide and the service that you have to provide, but there is no
you have to provide, but there is no
you have to provide, but there is no funding stream that is tied to it, who
funding stream that is tied to it, who
funding stream that is tied to it, who picks up the bill? We do.
picks up the bill? We do.
picks up the bill? We do. Those are the things that stick out to
Those are the things that stick out to
Those are the things that stick out to me. transportation, um, special
me. transportation, um, special
me. transportation, um, special education, and the retirement building
education, and the retirement building
education, and the retirement building aid has been grotesqually reduced. And
aid has been grotesqually reduced. And
aid has been grotesqually reduced. And so, as we try to maintain our schools,
so, as we try to maintain our schools,
so, as we try to maintain our schools, keep them current, keep them modern,
keep them current, keep them modern,
keep them current, keep them modern, keep them, you know, pleasant for
keep them, you know, pleasant for
keep them, you know, pleasant for students to come into to be in an
students to come into to be in an
students to come into to be in an environment where they're able to best
environment where they're able to best
environment where they're able to best learn. Um, the
learn. Um, the
learn. Um, the yeah, the um, building aid has been
yeah, the um, building aid has been
yeah, the um, building aid has been drastically reduced as well from the
drastically reduced as well from the
drastically reduced as well from the state level, you know, if we get any at
state level, you know, if we get any at
state level, you know, if we get any at all. So, you know, a number of these
all. So, you know, a number of these
all. So, you know, a number of these things that were once well funded at the
things that were once well funded at the
things that were once well funded at the state level are no longer being funded
state level are no longer being funded
state level are no longer being funded at the state level and they're now the
at the state level and they're now the
at the state level and they're now the expectation, well, if you're going to
expectation, well, if you're going to
expectation, well, if you're going to continue to provide the services and and
continue to provide the services and and
continue to provide the services and and I get it. I hear it all the time, but
I get it. I hear it all the time, but
I get it. I hear it all the time, but your enrollment has gone down. So, you
your enrollment has gone down. So, you
your enrollment has gone down. So, you should be able to cut your budgets and
should be able to cut your budgets and
should be able to cut your budgets and and let's be real
and let's be real
and let's be real honest about this. You know, if I lose
honest about this. You know, if I lose
honest about this. You know, if I lose 10 students in the Keen School District,
10 students in the Keen School District,
10 students in the Keen School District, I don't get to cut my budget by 10
I don't get to cut my budget by 10
I don't get to cut my budget by 10 students,
students,
students, I don't need one less teacher for that.
I don't need one less teacher for that.
I don't need one less teacher for that. Even a hundred students. If it was at
Even a hundred students. If it was at
Even a hundred students. If it was at Keen High School, which is our largest
Keen High School, which is our largest
Keen High School, which is our largest school, if we lost 50 kids, that doesn't
school, if we lost 50 kids, that doesn't
school, if we lost 50 kids, that doesn't mean, okay, well, 50 kids, that should
mean, okay, well, 50 kids, that should
mean, okay, well, 50 kids, that should be the workload or the case load of a
be the workload or the case load of a
be the workload or the case load of a teacher, so you can cut a teacher. It
teacher, so you can cut a teacher. It
teacher, so you can cut a teacher. It doesn't. The math does not ever work
doesn't. The math does not ever work
doesn't. The math does not ever work that way. If I use a smaller school in
that way. If I use a smaller school in
that way. If I use a smaller school in one of our town districts, um, like
one of our town districts, um, like
one of our town districts, um, like Marlo for example, where they've got
Marlo for example, where they've got
Marlo for example, where they've got roughly 40 students, if two kids go out,
roughly 40 students, if two kids go out,
roughly 40 students, if two kids go out, I can't lose a teacher because I still
I can't lose a teacher because I still
I can't lose a teacher because I still have students that need to be taught.
have students that need to be taught.
have students that need to be taught. So, our fixed costs don't often change
So, our fixed costs don't often change
So, our fixed costs don't often change until we are able to make those changes
until we are able to make those changes
until we are able to make those changes and meet the needs of the students when
and meet the needs of the students when
and meet the needs of the students when they come into our buildings. And so, I
they come into our buildings. And so, I
they come into our buildings. And so, I think those are the big drivers that
think those are the big drivers that
think those are the big drivers that I've seen in my time. Um, you know, I
I've seen in my time. Um, you know, I
I've seen in my time. Um, you know, I can't cite anything from 1960s. I wasn't
can't cite anything from 1960s. I wasn't
can't cite anything from 1960s. I wasn't really around at that time.
really around at that time.
really around at that time. >> I wasn't either.
>> I wasn't either.
>> I wasn't either. >> Yeah. So, so I'm gonna I'm gonna go on
>> Yeah. So, so I'm gonna I'm gonna go on
>> Yeah. So, so I'm gonna I'm gonna go on on the good word of the folks who were
on the good word of the folks who were
on the good word of the folks who were up here with me and say,
up here with me and say,
up here with me and say, >> yeah,
>> yeah,
>> yeah, >> but you know what I think, you know,
>> but you know what I think, you know,
>> but you know what I think, you know, Rob, thank you for that. You hit the
Rob, thank you for that. You hit the
Rob, thank you for that. You hit the nail on the head on a lot of things
nail on the head on a lot of things
nail on the head on a lot of things talking about the mandates that are
talking about the mandates that are
talking about the mandates that are driving these costs at the local level.
driving these costs at the local level.
driving these costs at the local level. And I want to talk about, you know, the
And I want to talk about, you know, the
And I want to talk about, you know, the declining state aid that you mentioned
declining state aid that you mentioned
declining state aid that you mentioned and is the current adequacy funding
and is the current adequacy funding
and is the current adequacy funding model we have working.
model we have working.
model we have working. >> Oh, wow. That is such a loaded question.
>> Oh, wow. That is such a loaded question.
>> Oh, wow. That is such a loaded question. So, here's the idea.
So, here's the idea.
So, here's the idea. >> Here, well, here here.
>> Here, well, here here.
>> Here, well, here here. >> Yeah. No, here's what I here's what I
>> Yeah. No, here's what I here's what I
>> Yeah. No, here's what I here's what I would say.
would say.
would say. >> Here's what I would say about that,
>> Here's what I would say about that,
>> Here's what I would say about that, right? Um, our public schools are very
right? Um, our public schools are very
right? Um, our public schools are very highly regulated, as I sort of
highly regulated, as I sort of
highly regulated, as I sort of articulated before. you know, we've got
articulated before. you know, we've got
articulated before. you know, we've got to have certain credentials for our
to have certain credentials for our
to have certain credentials for our staff and we've got to provide a lot of
staff and we've got to provide a lot of
staff and we've got to provide a lot of these other things. And we receive a
these other things. And we receive a
these other things. And we receive a base adequacy total of about $4,300 per
base adequacy total of about $4,300 per
base adequacy total of about $4,300 per student. $4,300.
student. $4,300.
student. $4,300. So, there's now this other mechanism to
So, there's now this other mechanism to
So, there's now this other mechanism to encourage people to buy into what's
encourage people to buy into what's
encourage people to buy into what's called an education freedom account so
called an education freedom account so
called an education freedom account so that they can go to a school of their
that they can go to a school of their
that they can go to a school of their choice, a private school or home school
choice, a private school or home school
choice, a private school or home school or whatever the case might be. That
or whatever the case might be. That
or whatever the case might be. That funding starts at about $5,300. So if
funding starts at about $5,300. So if
funding starts at about $5,300. So if you want to go to public school, we're
you want to go to public school, we're
you want to go to public school, we're only going to pay $4,300. But if you
only going to pay $4,300. But if you
only going to pay $4,300. But if you want to go to a different school, here's
want to go to a different school, here's
want to go to a different school, here's a check that will help offset those
a check that will help offset those
a check that will help offset those expenses by $1,000 more. So it's more
expenses by $1,000 more. So it's more
expenses by $1,000 more. So it's more beneficial to go to a different school.
beneficial to go to a different school.
beneficial to go to a different school. But what is really impactful is when
But what is really impactful is when
But what is really impactful is when those students take that education
those students take that education
those students take that education freedom account. And I I'm all for
freedom account. And I I'm all for
freedom account. And I I'm all for school choice. Don't please don't
school choice. Don't please don't
school choice. Don't please don't misunderstand me. I am absolutely for
misunderstand me. I am absolutely for
misunderstand me. I am absolutely for school choice.
school choice.
school choice. But when they take that that education
But when they take that that education
But when they take that that education freedom account and they go to a
freedom account and they go to a
freedom account and they go to a different school, it's kind of like a
different school, it's kind of like a
different school, it's kind of like a double hit, right? We don't get that
double hit, right? We don't get that
double hit, right? We don't get that adequacy funding in the local school
adequacy funding in the local school
adequacy funding in the local school district because they're now not a
district because they're now not a
district because they're now not a member of our school. So that $4,300, if
member of our school. So that $4,300, if
member of our school. So that $4,300, if you take, let's just use simple math. If
you take, let's just use simple math. If
you take, let's just use simple math. If you take 10 students, that's $43,000
you take 10 students, that's $43,000
you take 10 students, that's $43,000 bucks that would have come into the
bucks that would have come into the
bucks that would have come into the school that no longer goes to school.
school that no longer goes to school.
school that no longer goes to school. And if you take those 10 students at 53,
And if you take those 10 students at 53,
And if you take those 10 students at 53, they're now paying $10,000 more for
they're now paying $10,000 more for
they're now paying $10,000 more for those students to go to a school other
those students to go to a school other
those students to go to a school other than the public school. So you ask me if
than the public school. So you ask me if
than the public school. So you ask me if the adequacy um funding is working. I I
the adequacy um funding is working. I I
the adequacy um funding is working. I I think there have been some recent court
think there have been some recent court
think there have been some recent court decisions that have suggested that it's
decisions that have suggested that it's
decisions that have suggested that it's not and I think it's a constitutional
not and I think it's a constitutional
not and I think it's a constitutional issue that
issue that
issue that we have not resolved as a state.
we have not resolved as a state.
we have not resolved as a state. We know that the state of New Hampshire
We know that the state of New Hampshire
We know that the state of New Hampshire ranks last in terms of state funding
ranks last in terms of state funding
ranks last in terms of state funding across the country. And when we hear
across the country. And when we hear
across the country. And when we hear data that comes from our capital, they
data that comes from our capital, they
data that comes from our capital, they say, "Well, we've got the highest one of
say, "Well, we've got the highest one of
say, "Well, we've got the highest one of the highest cost per pupil in the
the highest cost per pupil in the
the highest cost per pupil in the country."
country."
country." That might be that, you know, that I I
That might be that, you know, that I I
That might be that, you know, that I I haven't actually dug in to see if we are
haven't actually dug in to see if we are
haven't actually dug in to see if we are truly the highest cost per pupil. What
truly the highest cost per pupil. What
truly the highest cost per pupil. What we do know is that the support that
we do know is that the support that
we do know is that the support that comes from the state is the lowest. I do
comes from the state is the lowest. I do
comes from the state is the lowest. I do know that.
know that.
know that. So,
So,
So, >> well, thank thank you, Rob. And we're
>> well, thank thank you, Rob. And we're
>> well, thank thank you, Rob. And we're gonna we're going to move on now to talk
gonna we're going to move on now to talk
gonna we're going to move on now to talk about the county and regional role. When
about the county and regional role. When
about the county and regional role. When we were uh proposing having this event
we were uh proposing having this event
we were uh proposing having this event tonight, um when you have a lot of
tonight, um when you have a lot of
tonight, um when you have a lot of conversations with folks in Keen and in
conversations with folks in Keen and in
conversations with folks in Keen and in New Hampshire, they often confuse county
New Hampshire, they often confuse county
New Hampshire, they often confuse county government with state government. And
government with state government. And
government with state government. And what essentially are the differences
what essentially are the differences
what essentially are the differences between this? So, Chris, you were
between this? So, Chris, you were
between this? So, Chris, you were looking for a softball apparently. Um
looking for a softball apparently. Um
looking for a softball apparently. Um how would you describe the current role
how would you describe the current role
how would you describe the current role of county government in New Hampshire?
of county government in New Hampshire?
of county government in New Hampshire? And is it working well? Are there gaps?
And is it working well? Are there gaps?
And is it working well? Are there gaps? Are we expanding county roles?
Are we expanding county roles?
Are we expanding county roles? >> That's a big question. Um we've been
>> That's a big question. Um we've been
>> That's a big question. Um we've been over the last five months the county
over the last five months the county
over the last five months the county commissioners
commissioners
commissioners u the our director of uh finance Cheryl
u the our director of uh finance Cheryl
u the our director of uh finance Cheryl Trombley and others have been um going
Trombley and others have been um going
Trombley and others have been um going out to the counties the towns in our in
out to the counties the towns in our in
out to the counties the towns in our in the county and really talking about this
the county and really talking about this
the county and really talking about this document that we we presented to you
document that we we presented to you
document that we we presented to you tonight and talking about Cheshire
tonight and talking about Cheshire
tonight and talking about Cheshire County at a glance because what a lot of
County at a glance because what a lot of
County at a glance because what a lot of people don't understand and it's
people don't understand and it's
people don't understand and it's interesting to me that one of the um
interesting to me that one of the um
interesting to me that one of the um individuals one of the selectmen in one
individuals one of the selectmen in one
individuals one of the selectmen in one of the towns and said, "So, you're
of the towns and said, "So, you're
of the towns and said, "So, you're you're like the quiet backbone
you're like the quiet backbone
you're like the quiet backbone of the region. You quietly just do your
of the region. You quietly just do your
of the region. You quietly just do your job." And it's it's it's pretty much
job." And it's it's it's pretty much
job." And it's it's it's pretty much true. What we do is we're you know what
true. What we do is we're you know what
true. What we do is we're you know what we do 85.6%
we do 85.6%
we do 85.6% of everything we do is statutoily
of everything we do is statutoily
of everything we do is statutoily required. The other 14% is the support,
required. The other 14% is the support,
required. The other 14% is the support, the IT, the HR, the finance departments.
the IT, the HR, the finance departments.
the IT, the HR, the finance departments. And you know, if you think about that,
And you know, if you think about that,
And you know, if you think about that, you know, 85, what do we we have the
you know, 85, what do we we have the
you know, 85, what do we we have the nursing home, but what many people don't
nursing home, but what many people don't
nursing home, but what many people don't know is the countyy's responsible for
know is the countyy's responsible for
know is the countyy's responsible for all individuals who qualify for Medicaid
all individuals who qualify for Medicaid
all individuals who qualify for Medicaid who are in a nursing home or at home
who are in a nursing home or at home
who are in a nursing home or at home giving getting home care. That's our
giving getting home care. That's our
giving getting home care. That's our responsibility and we cover that. We
responsibility and we cover that. We
responsibility and we cover that. We have the corrections facilities, we have
have the corrections facilities, we have
have the corrections facilities, we have the sheriff's department, we have, you
the sheriff's department, we have, you
the sheriff's department, we have, you know, a multitude. It's it's all right
know, a multitude. It's it's all right
know, a multitude. It's it's all right here. all 20 departments and we do it in
here. all 20 departments and we do it in
here. all 20 departments and we do it in a way that supports when when the city
a way that supports when when the city
a way that supports when when the city of Keen has somebody that needs to go to
of Keen has somebody that needs to go to
of Keen has somebody that needs to go to the hotel what we call the hotel on the
the hotel what we call the hotel on the
the hotel what we call the hotel on the hill and needs to be there for a period
hill and needs to be there for a period
hill and needs to be there for a period the correction facility um if the you
the correction facility um if the you
the correction facility um if the you know that's what you know they they need
know that's what you know they they need
know that's what you know they they need to be there for a period of time whether
to be there for a period of time whether
to be there for a period of time whether it's 24 hours 48 hours or longer that's
it's 24 hours 48 hours or longer that's
it's 24 hours 48 hours or longer that's why we're there you know if you have a
why we're there you know if you have a
why we're there you know if you have a loved one you want to have the nursing
loved one you want to have the nursing
loved one you want to have the nursing home here in this community. If we
home here in this community. If we
home here in this community. If we didn't have the nursing home here, then
didn't have the nursing home here, then
didn't have the nursing home here, then you would be traveling, loved ones would
you would be traveling, loved ones would
you would be traveling, loved ones would be traveling a distance to to stay in
be traveling a distance to to stay in
be traveling a distance to to stay in touch with those individuals. The other
touch with those individuals. The other
touch with those individuals. The other thing that many don't know is we have
thing that many don't know is we have
thing that many don't know is we have assisted living 20 apartments up at the
assisted living 20 apartments up at the
assisted living 20 apartments up at the nursing home that we have people. So, a
nursing home that we have people. So, a
nursing home that we have people. So, a lot of times what we find is that
lot of times what we find is that
lot of times what we find is that individuals um go in into those
individuals um go in into those
individuals um go in into those facilities and they uh the loved ones in
facilities and they uh the loved ones in
facilities and they uh the loved ones in the nursing home and the other ones the
the nursing home and the other ones the
the nursing home and the other ones the other spouse is in the in the assisted
other spouse is in the in the assisted
other spouse is in the in the assisted living. So we quietly go about our
living. So we quietly go about our
living. So we quietly go about our business but we also the ma one of the
business but we also the ma one of the
business but we also the ma one of the magic one of the things that's working
magic one of the things that's working
magic one of the things that's working really well I think is the partnerships
really well I think is the partnerships
really well I think is the partnerships we have with the people at the table you
we have with the people at the table you
we have with the people at the table you know we have a program called uh
know we have a program called uh
know we have a program called uh connected families New Hampshire it's a
connected families New Hampshire it's a
connected families New Hampshire it's a grant that started uh eight years ago
grant that started uh eight years ago
grant that started uh eight years ago it's a program that was two people it
it's a program that was two people it
it's a program that was two people it was a $4 million grant for four years to
was a $4 million grant for four years to
was a $4 million grant for four years to get a program where we would go in um
get a program where we would go in um
get a program where we would go in um bring have staff go in and work with
bring have staff go in and work with
bring have staff go in and work with with families that have children that
with families that have children that
with families that have children that are at high risk of out of district
are at high risk of out of district
are at high risk of out of district placement. Now, you have to remember two
placement. Now, you have to remember two
placement. Now, you have to remember two one high residential uh placement can be
one high residential uh placement can be
one high residential uh placement can be anywhere between 200 and 500,000 per
anywhere between 200 and 500,000 per
anywhere between 200 and 500,000 per child if you're putting them in
child if you're putting them in
child if you're putting them in residential and you're also paying for
residential and you're also paying for
residential and you're also paying for education. So, it it's you know, we're
education. So, it it's you know, we're
education. So, it it's you know, we're working with families to keep that child
working with families to keep that child
working with families to keep that child in the community working you because the
in the community working you because the
in the community working you because the schools do a great job. they work with
schools do a great job. they work with
schools do a great job. they work with but when three o'clock chimes that child
but when three o'clock chimes that child
but when three o'clock chimes that child then heads home and a lot of times the
then heads home and a lot of times the
then heads home and a lot of times the parent needs that support. So that's a
parent needs that support. So that's a
parent needs that support. So that's a partnership that's been going so well
partnership that's been going so well
partnership that's been going so well that you know we we told the state of
that you know we we told the state of
that you know we we told the state of New Hampshire and in the end of the
New Hampshire and in the end of the
New Hampshire and in the end of the grant if we don't get some level of
grant if we don't get some level of
grant if we don't get some level of daily rate through Medicaid we're
daily rate through Medicaid we're
daily rate through Medicaid we're closing the program down. They like the
closing the program down. They like the
closing the program down. They like the program so they fund gave us a daily
program so they fund gave us a daily
program so they fund gave us a daily rate. So no taxpayer dollars go into
rate. So no taxpayer dollars go into
rate. So no taxpayer dollars go into that program. It is solely 100%
that program. It is solely 100%
that program. It is solely 100% generated through Medicaid monies and
generated through Medicaid monies and
generated through Medicaid monies and that money turns enough money that it
that money turns enough money that it
that money turns enough money that it also gives us money to put towards back
also gives us money to put towards back
also gives us money to put towards back towards taxes. So, it's a great program
towards taxes. So, it's a great program
towards taxes. So, it's a great program because the state liked it so much that
because the state liked it so much that
because the state liked it so much that they took it to the next level and they
they took it to the next level and they
they took it to the next level and they said, "Can you do it in Sullivan County?
said, "Can you do it in Sullivan County?
said, "Can you do it in Sullivan County? Can you do it in Grafton County? Can you
Can you do it in Grafton County? Can you
Can you do it in Grafton County? Can you do it across the state?" And also, by
do it across the state?" And also, by
do it across the state?" And also, by the way, we're going to give you another
the way, we're going to give you another
the way, we're going to give you another grant that says that we want to bring
grant that says that we want to bring
grant that says that we want to bring kids back out of residential back home,
kids back out of residential back home,
kids back out of residential back home, but in a more thoughtful, pragmatic way.
but in a more thoughtful, pragmatic way.
but in a more thoughtful, pragmatic way. So, that's our partnerships that we
So, that's our partnerships that we
So, that's our partnerships that we have. We have restorative justice that
have. We have restorative justice that
have. We have restorative justice that we're doing um at the high school, you
we're doing um at the high school, you
we're doing um at the high school, you know, and that's been a great program
know, and that's been a great program
know, and that's been a great program that the high school's really taken on
that the high school's really taken on
that the high school's really taken on to and and it's a program that's right
to and and it's a program that's right
to and and it's a program that's right out of the county. And then we have a
out of the county. And then we have a
out of the county. And then we have a multitude of of things that we're doing.
multitude of of things that we're doing.
multitude of of things that we're doing. Some of them you'll be hearing in the
Some of them you'll be hearing in the
Some of them you'll be hearing in the future about hopefully, but um but it's
future about hopefully, but um but it's
future about hopefully, but um but it's it's that's the partnership we're in
it's that's the partnership we're in
it's that's the partnership we're in constant contact. And the other thing we
constant contact. And the other thing we
constant contact. And the other thing we do do is all of us stay in contact about
do do is all of us stay in contact about
do do is all of us stay in contact about major projects that are going through.
major projects that are going through.
major projects that are going through. And right now I can tell you in the
And right now I can tell you in the
And right now I can tell you in the county right now we're in a good
county right now we're in a good
county right now we're in a good situation because we don't see any major
situation because we don't see any major
situation because we don't see any major bonding projects coming up. We may have
bonding projects coming up. We may have
bonding projects coming up. We may have some smaller bonding projects a million
some smaller bonding projects a million
some smaller bonding projects a million dollars or two millions but not the 30
dollars or two millions but not the 30
dollars or two millions but not the 30 40 million type projects that are out
40 million type projects that are out
40 million type projects that are out there because our facilities are in good
there because our facilities are in good
there because our facilities are in good shape. And one of our one of our bonds
shape. And one of our one of our bonds
shape. And one of our one of our bonds will actually the Department of
will actually the Department of
will actually the Department of Correction bond ends or matures next
Correction bond ends or matures next
Correction bond ends or matures next year and so that will go off our our
year and so that will go off our our
year and so that will go off our our costs. So and the other thing that you
costs. So and the other thing that you
costs. So and the other thing that you you you need to really through the
you you need to really through the
you you need to really through the county's perspective, we've had major
county's perspective, we've had major
county's perspective, we've had major projects that we've had to take on that
projects that we've had to take on that
projects that we've had to take on that have not hit the tax base because we've
have not hit the tax base because we've
have not hit the tax base because we've chose to go after grants. One of the
chose to go after grants. One of the
chose to go after grants. One of the biggest projects is probably the
biggest projects is probably the
biggest projects is probably the sheriff's dispatch. The towers in our
sheriff's dispatch. The towers in our
sheriff's dispatch. The towers in our communities that communicate for all the
communities that communicate for all the
communities that communicate for all the law enforcement because all the law
law enforcement because all the law
law enforcement because all the law enforcement comes into our our into our
enforcement comes into our our into our
enforcement comes into our our into our dispatch and the sheriff's office is um
dispatch and the sheriff's office is um
dispatch and the sheriff's office is um they all they're at end of life to the
they all they're at end of life to the
they all they're at end of life to the point where we're going on eBay to find
point where we're going on eBay to find
point where we're going on eBay to find parts. And so we had a company Motorola
parts. And so we had a company Motorola
parts. And so we had a company Motorola come out and really do a survey of that.
come out and really do a survey of that.
come out and really do a survey of that. They said it's a $4.4 million project.
They said it's a $4.4 million project.
They said it's a $4.4 million project. and we were able to we were able to find
and we were able to we were able to find
and we were able to we were able to find the funds through grants to cover the
the funds through grants to cover the
the funds through grants to cover the cost so we didn't have to put them in in
cost so we didn't have to put them in in
cost so we didn't have to put them in in into the tax base. But that's the stuff
into the tax base. But that's the stuff
into the tax base. But that's the stuff that all of us are doing on a regular
that all of us are doing on a regular
that all of us are doing on a regular basis to try to offset what is being
basis to try to offset what is being
basis to try to offset what is being pushed down upon us. And I'll tell you
pushed down upon us. And I'll tell you
pushed down upon us. And I'll tell you that we did it so well that the
that we did it so well that the
that we did it so well that the Southwest Regional Planning, no
Southwest Regional Planning, no
Southwest Regional Planning, no Southwest Mutual Aid, Fire Mutual Aid,
Southwest Mutual Aid, Fire Mutual Aid,
Southwest Mutual Aid, Fire Mutual Aid, um has asked us to help with their their
um has asked us to help with their their
um has asked us to help with their their towers. And that's a $5.6 million
towers. And that's a $5.6 million
towers. And that's a $5.6 million project that we've been able to raise so
project that we've been able to raise so
project that we've been able to raise so far. $2.6 million. If we don't do that,
far. $2.6 million. If we don't do that,
far. $2.6 million. If we don't do that, we don't try to figure it out, it's
we don't try to figure it out, it's
we don't try to figure it out, it's about a 300, if they had to bond for all
about a 300, if they had to bond for all
about a 300, if they had to bond for all that, it's about a 350%
that, it's about a 350%
that, it's about a 350% increase to the users. City of Well,
increase to the users. City of Well,
increase to the users. City of Well, yeah. At city, anybody that uses that um
yeah. At city, anybody that uses that um
yeah. At city, anybody that uses that um every get it would be a 350% increase to
every get it would be a 350% increase to
every get it would be a 350% increase to what they're currently paying. So, it we
what they're currently paying. So, it we
what they're currently paying. So, it we have to go and we have to be aggressive
have to go and we have to be aggressive
have to go and we have to be aggressive and look at things in different ways.
and look at things in different ways.
and look at things in different ways. And that's one of the things I think
And that's one of the things I think
And that's one of the things I think that's working well for us. But I think
that's working well for us. But I think
that's working well for us. But I think that that from the county's perspective,
that that from the county's perspective,
that that from the county's perspective, we're trying to be nimble. We're trying
we're trying to be nimble. We're trying
we're trying to be nimble. We're trying to be uh meet the needs where we're at.
to be uh meet the needs where we're at.
to be uh meet the needs where we're at. It's interesting. You go out into these
It's interesting. You go out into these
It's interesting. You go out into these communities. These communities are like
communities. These communities are like
communities. These communities are like the city are struggling. They have law
the city are struggling. They have law
the city are struggling. They have law enforcement and you we hear all the time
enforcement and you we hear all the time
enforcement and you we hear all the time that the city keen eight to nine people
that the city keen eight to nine people
that the city keen eight to nine people down on the on the on the police side of
down on the on the on the police side of
down on the on the on the police side of things. Well, these departments have 10
things. Well, these departments have 10
things. Well, these departments have 10 people, five people. Well, that 10 is
people, five people. Well, that 10 is
people, five people. Well, that 10 is two. That's all they can get. or they
two. That's all they can get. or they
two. That's all they can get. or they put somebody all the way through the
put somebody all the way through the
put somebody all the way through the academy. He starts for a few months and
academy. He starts for a few months and
academy. He starts for a few months and then he he sees an opportunity and goes
then he he sees an opportunity and goes
then he he sees an opportunity and goes there. I we don't you don't we don't
there. I we don't you don't we don't
there. I we don't you don't we don't blame them at all. We see that at the
blame them at all. We see that at the
blame them at all. We see that at the Department of Corrections all the time.
Department of Corrections all the time.
Department of Corrections all the time. We see that as a a ground where people
We see that as a a ground where people
We see that as a a ground where people get that taste of of opportunity and
get that taste of of opportunity and
get that taste of of opportunity and then they really want to be in law
then they really want to be in law
then they really want to be in law enforcement. So, they get that and then
enforcement. So, they get that and then
enforcement. So, they get that and then they move on. And and we have to fill
they move on. And and we have to fill
they move on. And and we have to fill that gap. And uh it it is just something
that gap. And uh it it is just something
that gap. And uh it it is just something that you know we're we're constantly
that you know we're we're constantly
that you know we're we're constantly looking at and we're struggling with the
looking at and we're struggling with the
looking at and we're struggling with the to figure out all the time. I will also
to figure out all the time. I will also
to figure out all the time. I will also tell you that this on the radio the
tell you that this on the radio the
tell you that this on the radio the other day a caller came in and said you
other day a caller came in and said you
other day a caller came in and said you know
know
know do you ever compare like liked counties?
do you ever compare like liked counties?
do you ever compare like liked counties? So is there a county that's like you
So is there a county that's like you
So is there a county that's like you that you are you know financially
that you are you know financially
that you are you know financially comparing? We can do that on some
comparing? We can do that on some
comparing? We can do that on some levels. on some levels we can do that
levels. on some levels we can do that
levels. on some levels we can do that but not when it comes to the budget
but not when it comes to the budget
but not when it comes to the budget because we have so much that goes into
because we have so much that goes into
because we have so much that goes into that budget that we have to show
that budget that we have to show
that budget that we have to show everything. We have a grants department
everything. We have a grants department
everything. We have a grants department in in the county. We're really one of
in in the county. We're really one of
in in the county. We're really one of the only gr county that has a strong
the only gr county that has a strong
the only gr county that has a strong grants department. We have anywhere
grants department. We have anywhere
grants department. We have anywhere between 38 and 42 grants coming in to
between 38 and 42 grants coming in to
between 38 and 42 grants coming in to the through the uh through our grants
the through the uh through our grants
the through the uh through our grants department. That's about it can be
department. That's about it can be
department. That's about it can be anywhere between 13 and 16 million
anywhere between 13 and 16 million
anywhere between 13 and 16 million dollars that we're handling and a lot of
dollars that we're handling and a lot of
dollars that we're handling and a lot of that's passed through that goes to
that's passed through that goes to
that's passed through that goes to Cheshire Medical because they have a
Cheshire Medical because they have a
Cheshire Medical because they have a program but we're we're the ones that
program but we're we're the ones that
program but we're we're the ones that write the help write the grant you know
write the help write the grant you know
write the help write the grant you know um the rails trail you know we have you
um the rails trail you know we have you
um the rails trail you know we have you have in the city of Keen you have
have in the city of Keen you have
have in the city of Keen you have pathways but all the other rail trails
pathways but all the other rail trails
pathways but all the other rail trails around the city we write the grants for
around the city we write the grants for
around the city we write the grants for so that we can get those pathways those
so that we can get those pathways those
so that we can get those pathways those the rail trails done in a way that makes
the rail trails done in a way that makes
the rail trails done in a way that makes sense so people can travel on them and
sense so people can travel on them and
sense so people can travel on them and we think that's a good thing. We think
we think that's a good thing. We think
we think that's a good thing. We think it's an economic engine, but we also
it's an economic engine, but we also
it's an economic engine, but we also think it's something that people can get
think it's something that people can get
think it's something that people can get outside and enjoy. So, you know, when
outside and enjoy. So, you know, when
outside and enjoy. So, you know, when you look at it, we are constantly trying
you look at it, we are constantly trying
you look at it, we are constantly trying to fight the system, but it gets harder
to fight the system, but it gets harder
to fight the system, but it gets harder and harder every year when we're looking
and harder every year when we're looking
and harder every year when we're looking at it. And I just want to look and see
at it. And I just want to look and see
at it. And I just want to look and see if I'm missing anything. But I think the
if I'm missing anything. But I think the
if I'm missing anything. But I think the um I think that the the biggest issue
um I think that the the biggest issue
um I think that the the biggest issue for us right now is
for us right now is
for us right now is decisions that are made that aren't best
decisions that are made that aren't best
decisions that are made that aren't best practice. Okay, you have revenue, but
practice. Okay, you have revenue, but
practice. Okay, you have revenue, but then all of a sudden you decide to um
then all of a sudden you decide to um
then all of a sudden you decide to um end the dividends and interest tax. Now,
end the dividends and interest tax. Now,
end the dividends and interest tax. Now, some people might like this in that
some people might like this in that
some people might like this in that room, and that's great. I'm not saying
room, and that's great. I'm not saying
room, and that's great. I'm not saying I'm for it's just that to me, you
I'm for it's just that to me, you
I'm for it's just that to me, you canceled out that you the business tax,
canceled out that you the business tax,
canceled out that you the business tax, you reduce the business tax, not once,
you reduce the business tax, not once,
you reduce the business tax, not once, but twice. The BET tax, you know, you
but twice. The BET tax, you know, you
but twice. The BET tax, you know, you you reduce that. That's another And what
you reduce that. That's another And what
you reduce that. That's another And what what Elizabeth didn't tell you too is on
what Elizabeth didn't tell you too is on
what Elizabeth didn't tell you too is on the meals and room they they actually
the meals and room they they actually
the meals and room they they actually was it's nine it's a 9% tax that was
was it's nine it's a 9% tax that was
was it's nine it's a 9% tax that was brought was so they bumped it up to 30
brought was so they bumped it up to 30
brought was so they bumped it up to 30 but then they brought the tax rate of
but then they brought the tax rate of
but then they brought the tax rate of that down to 8.5. So actually you're lo
that down to 8.5. So actually you're lo
that down to 8.5. So actually you're lo there's a loss there with a gain and and
there's a loss there with a gain and and
there's a loss there with a gain and and so those are things that we're
so those are things that we're
so those are things that we're constantly trying to figure out and the
constantly trying to figure out and the
constantly trying to figure out and the one that easiest one for us is
one that easiest one for us is
one that easiest one for us is the nursing home all 10 counties
the nursing home all 10 counties
the nursing home all 10 counties together pay up to a certain point
together pay up to a certain point
together pay up to a certain point um and then the state at the cap it's
um and then the state at the cap it's
um and then the state at the cap it's called the cap Medicaid cap and they
called the cap Medicaid cap and they
called the cap Medicaid cap and they stay they pay up to a certain point and
stay they pay up to a certain point and
stay they pay up to a certain point and at that point then the state comes in
at that point then the state comes in
at that point then the state comes in and and pays and every year in the
and and pays and every year in the
and and pays and every year in the bianium um budget process there's a you
bianium um budget process there's a you
bianium um budget process there's a you know we talk about how much is going to
know we talk about how much is going to
know we talk about how much is going to the cap's going to rise every year and
the cap's going to rise every year and
the cap's going to rise every year and it's 2%. 2%. It's been 2% for years.
it's 2%. 2%. It's been 2% for years.
it's 2%. 2%. It's been 2% for years. This year they decided at the 11th hour
This year they decided at the 11th hour
This year they decided at the 11th hour to add 1%. That does not sound like a
to add 1%. That does not sound like a
to add 1%. That does not sound like a lot but what that 1% meant is a $4.4
lot but what that 1% meant is a $4.4
lot but what that 1% meant is a $4.4 million increase that was spread across
million increase that was spread across
million increase that was spread across 10 counties. That's a $440,000
10 counties. That's a $440,000
10 counties. That's a $440,000 increase of now what we have to pay up
increase of now what we have to pay up
increase of now what we have to pay up to before the the state will kick in and
to before the the state will kick in and
to before the the state will kick in and help pay for the Medicaid costs. Those
help pay for the Medicaid costs. Those
help pay for the Medicaid costs. Those are the things. It's it's uh what is it
are the things. It's it's uh what is it
are the things. It's it's uh what is it the cuts by a thousand thousand cuts
the cuts by a thousand thousand cuts
the cuts by a thousand thousand cuts >> death by a thousand cuts and and it's
>> death by a thousand cuts and and it's
>> death by a thousand cuts and and it's like that is what happened and and what
like that is what happened and and what
like that is what happened and and what they don't tell you is that they change
they don't tell you is that they change
they don't tell you is that they change the formulas but they also change fees.
the formulas but they also change fees.
the formulas but they also change fees. So, you know, if you have an LNA, if you
So, you know, if you have an LNA, if you
So, you know, if you have an LNA, if you have an a nurse that that they have to
have an a nurse that that they have to
have an a nurse that that they have to get the credentials and pay for the
get the credentials and pay for the
get the credentials and pay for the credentials on a yearly basis, they bump
credentials on a yearly basis, they bump
credentials on a yearly basis, they bump it up. or if you have a water and sewer
it up. or if you have a water and sewer
it up. or if you have a water and sewer treatment plant in your and we have that
treatment plant in your and we have that
treatment plant in your and we have that at the nursing home that used to be a
at the nursing home that used to be a
at the nursing home that used to be a $100 is now heading towards $4,000. It's
$100 is now heading towards $4,000. It's
$100 is now heading towards $4,000. It's little things here and there. Those are
little things here and there. Those are
little things here and there. Those are the things that we have to come up and
the things that we have to come up and
the things that we have to come up and and try to figure out as we work through
and try to figure out as we work through
and try to figure out as we work through it.
it.
it. >> Well, thank you for that, Chris. We're
>> Well, thank you for that, Chris. We're
>> Well, thank you for that, Chris. We're going to move along. We're going to move
going to move along. We're going to move
going to move along. We're going to move into kind of the state policy and
into kind of the state policy and
into kind of the state policy and mandates and we all briefly touched upon
mandates and we all briefly touched upon
mandates and we all briefly touched upon that a little bit. And I want to ask
that a little bit. And I want to ask
that a little bit. And I want to ask Margaret um you know we provided a lot
Margaret um you know we provided a lot
Margaret um you know we provided a lot of examples of this but can you talk
of examples of this but can you talk
of examples of this but can you talk about how these state mandates are
about how these state mandates are
about how these state mandates are increasing costs for municipalities and
increasing costs for municipalities and
increasing costs for municipalities and you know sort of what are the biggest
you know sort of what are the biggest
you know sort of what are the biggest cost drivers? We heard a little bit
cost drivers? We heard a little bit
cost drivers? We heard a little bit about that and I think we've heard this
about that and I think we've heard this
about that and I think we've heard this as well. Are these mandates increasing
as well. Are these mandates increasing
as well. Are these mandates increasing while revenue and funding is decreasing?
while revenue and funding is decreasing?
while revenue and funding is decreasing? Yeah, it's it's such a great question
Yeah, it's it's such a great question
Yeah, it's it's such a great question and it it's it's obvious, but it's worth
and it it's it's obvious, but it's worth
and it it's it's obvious, but it's worth saying that every time the state
saying that every time the state
saying that every time the state mandates that cities, towns, counties,
mandates that cities, towns, counties,
mandates that cities, towns, counties, or school districts do something new,
or school districts do something new,
or school districts do something new, but doesn't provide funding to do it,
but doesn't provide funding to do it,
but doesn't provide funding to do it, then it costs money to the county, town,
then it costs money to the county, town,
then it costs money to the county, town, or school school district. Right? That
or school school district. Right? That
or school school district. Right? That it's sort of an obvious statement, but
it's sort of an obvious statement, but
it's sort of an obvious statement, but it's just a good place to start. And for
it's just a good place to start. And for
it's just a good place to start. And for that reason, the New Hampshire
that reason, the New Hampshire
that reason, the New Hampshire Constitution has a provision, article
Constitution has a provision, article
Constitution has a provision, article 28A, that prohibits unfunded mandates.
28A, that prohibits unfunded mandates.
28A, that prohibits unfunded mandates. It prohibits the state from creating new
It prohibits the state from creating new
It prohibits the state from creating new mandates that cost money unless funding
mandates that cost money unless funding
mandates that cost money unless funding is provided. Again, it's a very simple
is provided. Again, it's a very simple
is provided. Again, it's a very simple concept. Unfortunately, the unfunded
concept. Unfortunately, the unfunded
concept. Unfortunately, the unfunded mandate provision has become um somewhat
mandate provision has become um somewhat
mandate provision has become um somewhat more of a suggestion. It's it's still in
more of a suggestion. It's it's still in
more of a suggestion. It's it's still in our constitution, but it really has not
our constitution, but it really has not
our constitution, but it really has not been respected and it's not a compelling
been respected and it's not a compelling
been respected and it's not a compelling argument anymore at the state
argument anymore at the state
argument anymore at the state legislature that this is a mandate. It
legislature that this is a mandate. It
legislature that this is a mandate. It costs money. You have to provide funding
costs money. You have to provide funding
costs money. You have to provide funding or you violate the constitution. It's
or you violate the constitution. It's
or you violate the constitution. It's just it's not a winning argument and yet
just it's not a winning argument and yet
just it's not a winning argument and yet it is part of our constitution. And so
it is part of our constitution. And so
it is part of our constitution. And so every time the state creates a new
every time the state creates a new
every time the state creates a new mandate and doesn't provide funding, the
mandate and doesn't provide funding, the
mandate and doesn't provide funding, the local governments pay for it. And
local governments pay for it. And
local governments pay for it. And because local governments are entire are
because local governments are entire are
because local governments are entire are highly rellyant on property taxes, it
highly rellyant on property taxes, it
highly rellyant on property taxes, it probably means property taxes pay for
probably means property taxes pay for
probably means property taxes pay for it. And mandates come in so many
it. And mandates come in so many
it. And mandates come in so many different forms. Chris mentioned death
different forms. Chris mentioned death
different forms. Chris mentioned death by a thousand cuts. There's there's
by a thousand cuts. There's there's
by a thousand cuts. There's there's small mandates that sort of are new um
small mandates that sort of are new um
small mandates that sort of are new um administrative requirements, new little
administrative requirements, new little
administrative requirements, new little picky administrative requirements that
picky administrative requirements that
picky administrative requirements that your staff have to handle or maybe you
your staff have to handle or maybe you
your staff have to handle or maybe you need another administrative person
need another administrative person
need another administrative person become because it becomes too much of a
become because it becomes too much of a
become because it becomes too much of a burden for the staff that you have and
burden for the staff that you have and
burden for the staff that you have and that's a cost. And then there's sort of
that's a cost. And then there's sort of
that's a cost. And then there's sort of the bigger broader cost. So, um, we've
the bigger broader cost. So, um, we've
the bigger broader cost. So, um, we've had over the past couple years a real
had over the past couple years a real
had over the past couple years a real push at the state legislature to address
push at the state legislature to address
push at the state legislature to address housing and most of that policy has
housing and most of that policy has
housing and most of that policy has played out in the form of new zoning
played out in the form of new zoning
played out in the form of new zoning mandates as a new requirements for
mandates as a new requirements for
mandates as a new requirements for municipalities at the local level. And
municipalities at the local level. And
municipalities at the local level. And when we talk about increases in
when we talk about increases in
when we talk about increases in population, especially increases in
population, especially increases in
population, especially increases in density, the costs that flow from that
density, the costs that flow from that
density, the costs that flow from that are the costs related to public services
are the costs related to public services
are the costs related to public services and infrastructure. And if there's not
and infrastructure. And if there's not
and infrastructure. And if there's not the correlating funding for those
the correlating funding for those
the correlating funding for those increases, then again, cities and towns
increases, then again, cities and towns
increases, then again, cities and towns are going to pay for it. And again,
are going to pay for it. And again,
are going to pay for it. And again, property taxes are going to be the
property taxes are going to be the
property taxes are going to be the likely place that that funding is going
likely place that that funding is going
likely place that that funding is going to come from. And so, you know, what's
to come from. And so, you know, what's
to come from. And so, you know, what's hitting cities and towns? Other other
hitting cities and towns? Other other
hitting cities and towns? Other other than um the mandates, we also have to
than um the mandates, we also have to
than um the mandates, we also have to keep in mind that if you're experiencing
keep in mind that if you're experiencing
keep in mind that if you're experiencing the burdens of inflation, you have to
the burdens of inflation, you have to
the burdens of inflation, you have to remember that your cities and towns are
remember that your cities and towns are
remember that your cities and towns are facing it too. Inflation is affecting
facing it too. Inflation is affecting
facing it too. Inflation is affecting everything across the board in local
everything across the board in local
everything across the board in local budgets. Labor, fuel, energy costs,
budgets. Labor, fuel, energy costs,
budgets. Labor, fuel, energy costs, materials, whatever it is, inflation is
materials, whatever it is, inflation is
materials, whatever it is, inflation is impacting municipalities as well. And in
impacting municipalities as well. And in
impacting municipalities as well. And in fact, we took a look at state aid dating
fact, we took a look at state aid dating
fact, we took a look at state aid dating back to 2009 up until uh present year
back to 2009 up until uh present year
back to 2009 up until uh present year and tracked sort of dollar for dollar as
and tracked sort of dollar for dollar as
and tracked sort of dollar for dollar as compared to inflation. And as compared
compared to inflation. And as compared
compared to inflation. And as compared back to 2009 when you apply inflation to
back to 2009 when you apply inflation to
back to 2009 when you apply inflation to the funding, we're actually behind 2009
the funding, we're actually behind 2009
the funding, we're actually behind 2009 when the inflation factor is applied.
when the inflation factor is applied.
when the inflation factor is applied. That's how significant of a reality
That's how significant of a reality
That's how significant of a reality those impacts are. So mandates are sort
those impacts are. So mandates are sort
those impacts are. So mandates are sort of the flip side of downshifting. We
of the flip side of downshifting. We
of the flip side of downshifting. We have the actual dollars being cut or not
have the actual dollars being cut or not
have the actual dollars being cut or not provided and then we have the new
provided and then we have the new
provided and then we have the new requirements on local governments that
requirements on local governments that
requirements on local governments that cost money to fulfill.
cost money to fulfill.
cost money to fulfill. >> Well, thank you for that. I next
>> Well, thank you for that. I next
>> Well, thank you for that. I next question. I think this is the question
question. I think this is the question
question. I think this is the question you guys all showed up for. What are the
you guys all showed up for. What are the
you guys all showed up for. What are the realistic paths to property tax relief?
realistic paths to property tax relief?
realistic paths to property tax relief? >> Who would like to answer that one?
>> Who would like to answer that one?
>> Who would like to answer that one? >> Do you want me to have Adam?
>> Do you want me to have Adam?
>> Do you want me to have Adam? >> You know, it's it's sort of like you
>> You know, it's it's sort of like you
>> You know, it's it's sort of like you just put the microphone in my hand, so
just put the microphone in my hand, so
just put the microphone in my hand, so I'd have to go ahead and and start with
I'd have to go ahead and and start with
I'd have to go ahead and and start with it. So, I'll I'll take it. I'll take the
it. So, I'll I'll take it. I'll take the
it. So, I'll I'll take it. I'll take the hot potato. So, um I think that there
hot potato. So, um I think that there
hot potato. So, um I think that there are le let's talk about sort of two two
are le let's talk about sort of two two
are le let's talk about sort of two two paths sort of two and a half paths to
paths sort of two and a half paths to
paths sort of two and a half paths to property tax relief. I'm gonna I'm gonna
property tax relief. I'm gonna I'm gonna
property tax relief. I'm gonna I'm gonna say the thing no one up here wants me to
say the thing no one up here wants me to
say the thing no one up here wants me to say, but then I'm gonna I'm going to
say, but then I'm gonna I'm going to
say, but then I'm gonna I'm going to walk it back. So, the first way is spend
walk it back. So, the first way is spend
walk it back. So, the first way is spend less. Spend less locally, spend less
less. Spend less locally, spend less
less. Spend less locally, spend less money. Um, don't spend as much on your
money. Um, don't spend as much on your
money. Um, don't spend as much on your staff. Don't spend as much on their
staff. Don't spend as much on their
staff. Don't spend as much on their health insurance. Don't do the road
health insurance. Don't do the road
health insurance. Don't do the road project. Don't put in that new park.
project. Don't put in that new park.
project. Don't put in that new park. Don't fix that building. Don't put a new
Don't fix that building. Don't put a new
Don't fix that building. Don't put a new roof on the town hall. Don't. That's
roof on the town hall. Don't. That's
roof on the town hall. Don't. That's that's one way. But you have to have the
that's one way. But you have to have the
that's one way. But you have to have the conversation with yourself about what
conversation with yourself about what
conversation with yourself about what the cost of not spending the money is.
the cost of not spending the money is.
the cost of not spending the money is. That's the flip side. So you don't spend
That's the flip side. So you don't spend
That's the flip side. So you don't spend a dollar today. What's the cost two
a dollar today. What's the cost two
a dollar today. What's the cost two years from today? And then if you factor
years from today? And then if you factor
years from today? And then if you factor in inflation, every project delayed is
in inflation, every project delayed is
in inflation, every project delayed is more expensive later on. Right? So, if
more expensive later on. Right? So, if
more expensive later on. Right? So, if we know a building needs to be fixed, if
we know a building needs to be fixed, if
we know a building needs to be fixed, if we know a roof needs to be put on, if we
we know a roof needs to be put on, if we
we know a roof needs to be put on, if we know we're all losing our blowing out
know we're all losing our blowing out
know we're all losing our blowing out our tires on that road, but we put it
our tires on that road, but we put it
our tires on that road, but we put it off, what's the cost of doing it five
off, what's the cost of doing it five
off, what's the cost of doing it five years from now as opposed to today? So,
years from now as opposed to today? So,
years from now as opposed to today? So, that's number one. It's spend less, but
that's number one. It's spend less, but
that's number one. It's spend less, but ask yourself what the cost is of
ask yourself what the cost is of
ask yourself what the cost is of spending less. So, then we get to option
spending less. So, then we get to option
spending less. So, then we get to option two, which is sort of a two-parter. One
two, which is sort of a two-parter. One
two, which is sort of a two-parter. One way of property tax relief is more
way of property tax relief is more
way of property tax relief is more funding from the state level back down
funding from the state level back down
funding from the state level back down to cities, towns, counties, school
to cities, towns, counties, school
to cities, towns, counties, school districts, etc. So, more funding from
districts, etc. So, more funding from
districts, etc. So, more funding from the state, whether it's in the form of
the state, whether it's in the form of
the state, whether it's in the form of revenue sharing, whether it's in uh
revenue sharing, whether it's in uh
revenue sharing, whether it's in uh targeted aid like the state aid grants
targeted aid like the state aid grants
targeted aid like the state aid grants for sewer and water projects, targeted
for sewer and water projects, targeted
for sewer and water projects, targeted aid like building aid for school um
aid like building aid for school um
aid like building aid for school um school building projects, or or general
school building projects, or or general
school building projects, or or general fund revenue sharing like we've talked
fund revenue sharing like we've talked
fund revenue sharing like we've talked about with um the revenue sharing
about with um the revenue sharing
about with um the revenue sharing statute that used to exist or meals and
statute that used to exist or meals and
statute that used to exist or meals and rooms tax and and sort of that that line
rooms tax and and sort of that that line
rooms tax and and sort of that that line of thinking. The other piece to it is
of thinking. The other piece to it is
of thinking. The other piece to it is another way to offset property taxes is
another way to offset property taxes is
another way to offset property taxes is to give local governments more ways to
to give local governments more ways to
to give local governments more ways to raise money locally that is not property
raise money locally that is not property
raise money locally that is not property taxes. We tal we mentioned at the
taxes. We tal we mentioned at the
taxes. We tal we mentioned at the beginning that New Hampshire is highly
beginning that New Hampshire is highly
beginning that New Hampshire is highly reliant on property taxes and that
reliant on property taxes and that
reliant on property taxes and that municipalities are highly restricted in
municipalities are highly restricted in
municipalities are highly restricted in what they can raise locally. And this
what they can raise locally. And this
what they can raise locally. And this means they are restricted in what they
means they are restricted in what they
means they are restricted in what they can raise locally for taxes. They can
can raise locally for taxes. They can
can raise locally for taxes. They can raise property taxes. That's what
raise property taxes. That's what
raise property taxes. That's what they're allowed to do. And they also are
they're allowed to do. And they also are
they're allowed to do. And they also are restricted in the types of fees that
restricted in the types of fees that
restricted in the types of fees that they can raise locally as well. It's not
they can raise locally as well. It's not
they can raise locally as well. It's not just come up with any fee that a city or
just come up with any fee that a city or
just come up with any fee that a city or town or a county thinks would be
town or a county thinks would be
town or a county thinks would be helpful. It really has to come from an
helpful. It really has to come from an
helpful. It really has to come from an enabling statute, meaning a law that
enabling statute, meaning a law that
enabling statute, meaning a law that allows them to do it. And so a really
allows them to do it. And so a really
allows them to do it. And so a really simple example is that there's been a a
simple example is that there's been a a
simple example is that there's been a a bill that percolates in the legislature
bill that percolates in the legislature
bill that percolates in the legislature almost almost every single year. It's
almost almost every single year. It's
almost almost every single year. It's usually referred to as the occupancy
usually referred to as the occupancy
usually referred to as the occupancy fee. And it's an enabling piece of
fee. And it's an enabling piece of
fee. And it's an enabling piece of legislation that would allow cities and
legislation that would allow cities and
legislation that would allow cities and towns to adopt a fee on hotel room
towns to adopt a fee on hotel room
towns to adopt a fee on hotel room reservations. And the fee would go into
reservations. And the fee would go into
reservations. And the fee would go into a local fund that is restricted for the
a local fund that is restricted for the
a local fund that is restricted for the purpose of funding costs that are
purpose of funding costs that are
purpose of funding costs that are related to increased tourism. So think
related to increased tourism. So think
related to increased tourism. So think roads, think public safety, think what
roads, think public safety, think what
roads, think public safety, think what you know the tourism towns and cities
you know the tourism towns and cities
you know the tourism towns and cities get as a boom when when the tourism
get as a boom when when the tourism
get as a boom when when the tourism season hits. This has been a perennial
season hits. This has been a perennial
season hits. This has been a perennial effort. It has routinely not been
effort. It has routinely not been
effort. It has routinely not been passed. It is a small fee. It is
passed. It is a small fee. It is
passed. It is a small fee. It is optional and it's again it's meant to
optional and it's again it's meant to
optional and it's again it's meant to offset property tax costs by creating a
offset property tax costs by creating a
offset property tax costs by creating a new way of raising revenue on folks who
new way of raising revenue on folks who
new way of raising revenue on folks who enjoy the tourism aspects of our state.
enjoy the tourism aspects of our state.
enjoy the tourism aspects of our state. So, if state aid increases
So, if state aid increases
So, if state aid increases are not in the cards, we're never going
are not in the cards, we're never going
are not in the cards, we're never going to stop advocating for them. But there
to stop advocating for them. But there
to stop advocating for them. But there is another way, and it's to think
is another way, and it's to think
is another way, and it's to think broader. It's to think about how to
broader. It's to think about how to
broader. It's to think about how to enable cities and towns to meet local
enable cities and towns to meet local
enable cities and towns to meet local needs in other ways than high reliance
needs in other ways than high reliance
needs in other ways than high reliance on property taxes.
>> Anyone else want to take a bite of that
>> Anyone else want to take a bite of that apple?
apple?
apple? >> Yeah, just a couple of add-ons. And I I
>> Yeah, just a couple of add-ons. And I I
>> Yeah, just a couple of add-ons. And I I think that was incredibly thorough. And
think that was incredibly thorough. And
think that was incredibly thorough. And so I'm not really sure that I um like
so I'm not really sure that I um like
so I'm not really sure that I um like how you started, but you definitely
how you started, but you definitely
how you started, but you definitely walked it back really well. Um
walked it back really well. Um
walked it back really well. Um you know, there there used to be what
you know, there there used to be what
you know, there there used to be what what is referred to as a statewide
what is referred to as a statewide
what is referred to as a statewide education property tax where all of the
education property tax where all of the
education property tax where all of the funding from all of the municipalities
funding from all of the municipalities
funding from all of the municipalities went into one pot and then it got
went into one pot and then it got
went into one pot and then it got distributed where it was needed. And
distributed where it was needed. And
distributed where it was needed. And that created a lot more balance across
that created a lot more balance across
that created a lot more balance across the state and that is that has
the state and that is that has
the state and that is that has essentially gone away. So what's raised
essentially gone away. So what's raised
essentially gone away. So what's raised on your education on your tax bill that
on your education on your tax bill that
on your education on your tax bill that says state education tax never actually
says state education tax never actually
says state education tax never actually leaves your municipality. So property
leaves your municipality. So property
leaves your municipality. So property rich places they raise a bunch of money
rich places they raise a bunch of money
rich places they raise a bunch of money but it goes right back to them instead
but it goes right back to them instead
but it goes right back to them instead of going into that pot and getting
of going into that pot and getting
of going into that pot and getting shared across the state a little bit
shared across the state a little bit
shared across the state a little bit more evenly. So I I think a
more evenly. So I I think a
more evenly. So I I think a reconsideration of how that is
reconsideration of how that is
reconsideration of how that is administered is something that could be
administered is something that could be
administered is something that could be looked at. I think that was also a court
looked at. I think that was also a court
looked at. I think that was also a court ruling that was pretty recent in the
ruling that was pretty recent in the
ruling that was pretty recent in the last year and a half um that says we're
last year and a half um that says we're
last year and a half um that says we're not actually fulfilling that requirement
not actually fulfilling that requirement
not actually fulfilling that requirement as was expected by law. So, um, that one
as was expected by law. So, um, that one
as was expected by law. So, um, that one comes to mind. And the other one that
comes to mind. And the other one that
comes to mind. And the other one that comes to mind, and Senator, this might
comes to mind, and Senator, this might
comes to mind, and Senator, this might not maybe this will be popular for you,
not maybe this will be popular for you,
not maybe this will be popular for you, is to pay attention when you go to the
is to pay attention when you go to the
is to pay attention when you go to the polls in November.
polls in November.
polls in November. Know who you're voting for.
>> I think you guys did a great job
>> I think you guys did a great job covering that. Um, it does first start
covering that. Um, it does first start
covering that. Um, it does first start with looking internally at what you have
with looking internally at what you have
with looking internally at what you have and what you want as a community. What
and what you want as a community. What
and what you want as a community. What do you want for levels of service? What
do you want for levels of service? What
do you want for levels of service? What do you want in terms of infrastructure
do you want in terms of infrastructure
do you want in terms of infrastructure investment? It does always start there.
investment? It does always start there.
investment? It does always start there. Um, but that doesn't mean we stop
Um, but that doesn't mean we stop
Um, but that doesn't mean we stop fighting with the state about giving us
fighting with the state about giving us
fighting with the state about giving us our fair share. And I was at a different
our fair share. And I was at a different
our fair share. And I was at a different meeting this week and I talked about one
meeting this week and I talked about one
meeting this week and I talked about one of the things I'm most concerned about.
of the things I'm most concerned about.
of the things I'm most concerned about. I'm concerned about the funding of
I'm concerned about the funding of
I'm concerned about the funding of education. If you look what's happening
education. If you look what's happening
education. If you look what's happening over the last several years and the
over the last several years and the
over the last several years and the impacts that's that is having on our tax
impacts that's that is having on our tax
impacts that's that is having on our tax rate, it's incredible and it's unfair.
rate, it's incredible and it's unfair.
rate, it's incredible and it's unfair. The way that the system is set up right
The way that the system is set up right
The way that the system is set up right now, um it's based on a a number. I
now, um it's based on a a number. I
now, um it's based on a a number. I don't even know where that number
don't even know where that number
don't even know where that number originally came from in terms of an
originally came from in terms of an
originally came from in terms of an adequate education. It's not even close
adequate education. It's not even close
adequate education. It's not even close to what an adequate education cost is.
to what an adequate education cost is.
to what an adequate education cost is. And then it leaves the rest of it up to
And then it leaves the rest of it up to
And then it leaves the rest of it up to every community to fund. And the problem
every community to fund. And the problem
every community to fund. And the problem with that is some communities can fund a
with that is some communities can fund a
with that is some communities can fund a level of education similar to what we're
level of education similar to what we're
level of education similar to what we're funding and it's no burden to them at
funding and it's no burden to them at
funding and it's no burden to them at all because they have a very high tax
all because they have a very high tax
all because they have a very high tax base. They have a lake. They have
base. They have a lake. They have
base. They have a lake. They have whatever it is in their community. And
whatever it is in their community. And
whatever it is in their community. And so it's unevenly burdening communities.
so it's unevenly burdening communities.
so it's unevenly burdening communities. The ones that have the higher assessed
The ones that have the higher assessed
The ones that have the higher assessed values are able to afford more. The ones
values are able to afford more. The ones
values are able to afford more. The ones with the lower values aren't. or if they
with the lower values aren't. or if they
with the lower values aren't. or if they are doing it, it's pushing it down on
are doing it, it's pushing it down on
are doing it, it's pushing it down on that tax rate. And so I'm really really
that tax rate. And so I'm really really
that tax rate. And so I'm really really concerned about that. I do like the idea
concerned about that. I do like the idea
concerned about that. I do like the idea about more local options. We are always
about more local options. We are always
about more local options. We are always pushing for local control. Um because
pushing for local control. Um because
pushing for local control. Um because there's usually not a fix that fits
there's usually not a fix that fits
there's usually not a fix that fits everyone. Um there's usually something
everyone. Um there's usually something
everyone. Um there's usually something that's unique in your community that may
that's unique in your community that may
that's unique in your community that may not be the same for your neighbor,
not be the same for your neighbor,
not be the same for your neighbor, something that you're experiencing. And
something that you're experiencing. And
something that you're experiencing. And the more that the the state takes away
the more that the the state takes away
the more that the the state takes away local control, the harder it is for us
local control, the harder it is for us
local control, the harder it is for us to address those types of things. Um,
to address those types of things. Um,
to address those types of things. Um, and so I think those are I mean and
and so I think those are I mean and
and so I think those are I mean and obviously we try to increase our tax
obviously we try to increase our tax
obviously we try to increase our tax base. But we only have so much property
base. But we only have so much property
base. But we only have so much property in our city and not a ton left to
in our city and not a ton left to
in our city and not a ton left to develop. So that gets harder and harder
develop. So that gets harder and harder
develop. So that gets harder and harder as well. And I'll just say one other
as well. And I'll just say one other
as well. And I'll just say one other thing. We always ask for economic
thing. We always ask for economic
thing. We always ask for economic development tools from the state and the
development tools from the state and the
development tools from the state and the ones they give us are always on the
ones they give us are always on the
ones they give us are always on the backs of the taxpayers. They always are
backs of the taxpayers. They always are
backs of the taxpayers. They always are ones that say, "Sure, you can provide an
ones that say, "Sure, you can provide an
ones that say, "Sure, you can provide an incentive for economic development if
incentive for economic development if
incentive for economic development if you fund it through your local taxes as
you fund it through your local taxes as
you fund it through your local taxes as not coming from the state." Something as
not coming from the state." Something as
not coming from the state." Something as simple as the housing champions program,
simple as the housing champions program,
simple as the housing champions program, which the city worked really hard to be
which the city worked really hard to be
which the city worked really hard to be certified in this housing champions
certified in this housing champions
certified in this housing champions program. We've done a lot of really
program. We've done a lot of really
program. We've done a lot of really great work over the last few years to
great work over the last few years to
great work over the last few years to encourage housing development.
encourage housing development.
encourage housing development. We did it because we wanted to be able
We did it because we wanted to be able
We did it because we wanted to be able to access funds that they had promised
to access funds that they had promised
to access funds that they had promised to make available to only the
to make available to only the
to make available to only the communities that were housing champions.
communities that were housing champions.
communities that were housing champions. So, we put oursel through that process
So, we put oursel through that process
So, we put oursel through that process and then they quickly took away the
and then they quickly took away the
and then they quickly took away the money that was associated with it.
money that was associated with it.
money that was associated with it. >> I I would agree that we have to look
>> I I would agree that we have to look
>> I I would agree that we have to look internally first and we do. I mean, for
internally first and we do. I mean, for
internally first and we do. I mean, for you that you may not know, but when the
you that you may not know, but when the
you that you may not know, but when the budget process starts for the county, it
budget process starts for the county, it
budget process starts for the county, it starts in August. We adopt the budget in
starts in August. We adopt the budget in
starts in August. We adopt the budget in March. Um we actually um in September
March. Um we actually um in September
March. Um we actually um in September it's when myself and the director of
it's when myself and the director of
it's when myself and the director of finance really start looking at it. In
finance really start looking at it. In
finance really start looking at it. In October we bring it to the commissioners
October we bring it to the commissioners
October we bring it to the commissioners who are here tonight. Um and uh they we
who are here tonight. Um and uh they we
who are here tonight. Um and uh they we spend five weeks with the department
spend five weeks with the department
spend five weeks with the department heads going through line by line and
heads going through line by line and
heads going through line by line and trying to figure out where we're going
trying to figure out where we're going
trying to figure out where we're going to land. And then in December, we bring
to land. And then in December, we bring
to land. And then in December, we bring this to the delegation as a whole,
this to the delegation as a whole,
this to the delegation as a whole, present it, and then we pass it over to
present it, and then we pass it over to
present it, and then we pass it over to the executive committee, which is made
the executive committee, which is made
the executive committee, which is made up of 10 10 state reps to in January
up of 10 10 state reps to in January
up of 10 10 state reps to in January start doing another five weeks of going
start doing another five weeks of going
start doing another five weeks of going through and looking at line by line with
through and looking at line by line with
through and looking at line by line with department heads where we're going to
department heads where we're going to
department heads where we're going to where we're going to land on the budget.
where we're going to land on the budget.
where we're going to land on the budget. And it and we're we're proud in the
And it and we're we're proud in the
And it and we're we're proud in the county when we take a look at where our
county when we take a look at where our
county when we take a look at where our you know taxes to be raised has has gone
you know taxes to be raised has has gone
you know taxes to be raised has has gone over the last seven eight years because
over the last seven eight years because
over the last seven eight years because if you you know if you look at it and
if you you know if you look at it and
if you you know if you look at it and it's on the back side of your the
it's on the back side of your the
it's on the back side of your the document that we gave you it's in the
document that we gave you it's in the
document that we gave you it's in the blue line you know it's you know in 2019
blue line you know it's you know in 2019
blue line you know it's you know in 2019 it was 73 in 2020 is 1.39 in 2021 0%.
it was 73 in 2020 is 1.39 in 2021 0%.
it was 73 in 2020 is 1.39 in 2021 0%. 1.31 in 2022, 0% in 2023
1.31 in 2022, 0% in 2023
1.31 in 2022, 0% in 2023 and negative.9
and negative.9
and negative.9 um in 2024 and then 3.4 last year. So
um in 2024 and then 3.4 last year. So
um in 2024 and then 3.4 last year. So that if average out, yeah, it's about a
that if average out, yeah, it's about a
that if average out, yeah, it's about a 6% increase over that period of time,
6% increase over that period of time,
6% increase over that period of time, but it's less than 1% average uh in in
but it's less than 1% average uh in in
but it's less than 1% average uh in in that period of time at the same time.
that period of time at the same time.
that period of time at the same time. And we're still evolving. We're still
And we're still evolving. We're still
And we're still evolving. We're still growing. And there's and that's the the
growing. And there's and that's the the
growing. And there's and that's the the big thing that we need to continue to
big thing that we need to continue to
big thing that we need to continue to meet the needs of our communities and
meet the needs of our communities and
meet the needs of our communities and that's what we're hearing at the same
that's what we're hearing at the same
that's what we're hearing at the same time. So it is a a fine line. The other
time. So it is a a fine line. The other
time. So it is a a fine line. The other thing is we have to create revenue
thing is we have to create revenue
thing is we have to create revenue opportunities outside of the tax system
opportunities outside of the tax system
opportunities outside of the tax system and that's what we do. We look at grants
and that's what we do. We look at grants
and that's what we do. We look at grants constantly to see if we can do projects
constantly to see if we can do projects
constantly to see if we can do projects through grants. We also we have 50
through grants. We also we have 50
through grants. We also we have 50 federal inmates. Why? because our local
federal inmates. Why? because our local
federal inmates. Why? because our local is about 6070 and if we add in 50 that
is about 6070 and if we add in 50 that
is about 6070 and if we add in 50 that adds about a two $2 million uh or a
adds about a two $2 million uh or a
adds about a two $2 million uh or a little over $2 million in revenues that
little over $2 million in revenues that
little over $2 million in revenues that we can put back towards the fund balance
we can put back towards the fund balance
we can put back towards the fund balance to help offset taxes. You know, those
to help offset taxes. You know, those
to help offset taxes. You know, those are things that we're constantly doing.
are things that we're constantly doing.
are things that we're constantly doing. But I'll tell you one other thing I
But I'll tell you one other thing I
But I'll tell you one other thing I didn't bring up before and I want to say
didn't bring up before and I want to say
didn't bring up before and I want to say it is that um when when somebody comes
it is that um when when somebody comes
it is that um when when somebody comes into our nursing home and they have
into our nursing home and they have
into our nursing home and they have they're on Medicaid, they they they they
they're on Medicaid, they they they they
they're on Medicaid, they they they they have to qualify for Medicaid and and so
have to qualify for Medicaid and and so
have to qualify for Medicaid and and so they go on what we call um Medicaid
they go on what we call um Medicaid
they go on what we call um Medicaid pending eligible and so there's a lot of
pending eligible and so there's a lot of
pending eligible and so there's a lot of paperwork that has to be done and but we
paperwork that has to be done and but we
paperwork that has to be done and but we have to care for that. We we care for
have to care for that. We we care for
have to care for that. We we care for that individual while they're there. Why
that individual while they're there. Why
that individual while they're there. Why the state then we send that paperwork to
the state then we send that paperwork to
the state then we send that paperwork to the state. They're supposed to turn
the state. They're supposed to turn
the state. They're supposed to turn around in 45 days. Okay. So, we're
around in 45 days. Okay. So, we're
around in 45 days. Okay. So, we're paying in 45 days. It's taking about a
paying in 45 days. It's taking about a
paying in 45 days. It's taking about a year for them to turn around. We have 16
year for them to turn around. We have 16
year for them to turn around. We have 16 of those currently that are pending and
of those currently that are pending and
of those currently that are pending and that's lost revenue to us to the tune of
that's lost revenue to us to the tune of
that's lost revenue to us to the tune of five or six million dollars that we have
five or six million dollars that we have
five or six million dollars that we have to we have to come up with through the
to we have to come up with through the
to we have to come up with through the tax base because it's statutoily
tax base because it's statutoily
tax base because it's statutoily required that we have to do this care.
required that we have to do this care.
required that we have to do this care. And so where where where can we start
And so where where where can we start
And so where where where can we start pushing back? That's the other part of
pushing back? That's the other part of
pushing back? That's the other part of it that we need to be doing and we are
it that we need to be doing and we are
it that we need to be doing and we are doing. I see it all the time that we're
doing. I see it all the time that we're
doing. I see it all the time that we're speaking out. We're heading up, you
speaking out. We're heading up, you
speaking out. We're heading up, you know, leadership boards on on the on the
know, leadership boards on on the on the
know, leadership boards on on the on the municipal sides, on the on the school
municipal sides, on the on the school
municipal sides, on the on the school sides and in the county side where we're
sides and in the county side where we're
sides and in the county side where we're in leadership on those things. We're
in leadership on those things. We're
in leadership on those things. We're advocating down in Washington because
advocating down in Washington because
advocating down in Washington because listen um for Medicaid rates and the
listen um for Medicaid rates and the
listen um for Medicaid rates and the only way we're going to get the Medicaid
only way we're going to get the Medicaid
only way we're going to get the Medicaid rate up in New Hampshire for nursing
rate up in New Hampshire for nursing
rate up in New Hampshire for nursing home care is if we go down to the going
home care is if we go down to the going
home care is if we go down to the going to down to the feds and tell them bump
to down to the feds and tell them bump
to down to the feds and tell them bump up the Medicare rate. So if you bump up
up the Medicare rate. So if you bump up
up the Medicare rate. So if you bump up the Medicare then I can go back to the
the Medicare then I can go back to the
the Medicare then I can go back to the state and say you should be matching
state and say you should be matching
state and say you should be matching that. And it does work because last year
that. And it does work because last year
that. And it does work because last year we we had some success when it came to
we we had some success when it came to
we we had some success when it came to private insurance um bumping up to meet
private insurance um bumping up to meet
private insurance um bumping up to meet some ambulance rates that they were they
some ambulance rates that they were they
some ambulance rates that they were they were paying less than Medicaid. Um, and
were paying less than Medicaid. Um, and
were paying less than Medicaid. Um, and so you can battle back. You can fight.
so you can battle back. You can fight.
so you can battle back. You can fight. And I will tell you that our state reps
And I will tell you that our state reps
And I will tell you that our state reps in this area are fighters. They go up
in this area are fighters. They go up
in this area are fighters. They go up there all the time. They they they they
there all the time. They they they they
there all the time. They they they they they put out um their the what they've
they put out um their the what they've
they put out um their the what they've want. They they speak out on how they
want. They they speak out on how they
want. They they speak out on how they want to be heard and they they they
want to be heard and they they they
want to be heard and they they they represent us well. And I appreciate the
represent us well. And I appreciate the
represent us well. And I appreciate the because it it's not an easy task that
because it it's not an easy task that
because it it's not an easy task that they have up there and that's what we
they have up there and that's what we
they have up there and that's what we can Yeah. I round applause.
can Yeah. I round applause.
can Yeah. I round applause. But it it it is we have to fight back,
But it it it is we have to fight back,
But it it it is we have to fight back, too. We can't just sit still. And so
too. We can't just sit still. And so
too. We can't just sit still. And so when when crazy bills come up, we will
when when crazy bills come up, we will
when when crazy bills come up, we will be testifying up in conquered. When they
be testifying up in conquered. When they
be testifying up in conquered. When they tell us, they're going to tell us how we
tell us, they're going to tell us how we
tell us, they're going to tell us how we can bond. Um we're going to go up there
can bond. Um we're going to go up there
can bond. Um we're going to go up there and we're going to sit there and listen
and we're going to sit there and listen
and we're going to sit there and listen to them. Then we're going to get up and
to them. Then we're going to get up and
to them. Then we're going to get up and have them say, have them understand,
have them say, have them understand,
have them say, have them understand, listen, we already have an RSA, RSA 33,
listen, we already have an RSA, RSA 33,
listen, we already have an RSA, RSA 33, that we have to abide by when it comes
that we have to abide by when it comes
that we have to abide by when it comes to bonding. There's bond council.
to bonding. There's bond council.
to bonding. There's bond council. There's a lot of things that we knew. we
There's a lot of things that we knew. we
There's a lot of things that we knew. we just can't go out and spend money. We
just can't go out and spend money. We
just can't go out and spend money. We have to go through all these steps. And
have to go through all these steps. And
have to go through all these steps. And when they talk about the county taking
when they talk about the county taking
when they talk about the county taking over the SAUS, we go up and we test
over the SAUS, we go up and we test
over the SAUS, we go up and we test something and say, "What are you
something and say, "What are you
something and say, "What are you thinking?" You know, and that's what
thinking?" You know, and that's what
thinking?" You know, and that's what we're going to continue. That's the
we're going to continue. That's the
we're going to continue. That's the other side of it is that we all are up
other side of it is that we all are up
other side of it is that we all are up here on a daily basis voicing our
here on a daily basis voicing our
here on a daily basis voicing our concern. Well, well, thank you guys for
concern. Well, well, thank you guys for
concern. Well, well, thank you guys for that. Um, we had a couple more
that. Um, we had a couple more
that. Um, we had a couple more questions, but I think it's time we're
questions, but I think it's time we're
questions, but I think it's time we're going to move into the audience
going to move into the audience
going to move into the audience questions. I got a lot of orange cards
questions. I got a lot of orange cards
questions. I got a lot of orange cards up here and that's a good thing from a a
up here and that's a good thing from a a
up here and that's a good thing from a a wide range and this has been a really
wide range and this has been a really
wide range and this has been a really important discussion and my first card
important discussion and my first card
important discussion and my first card which I love this is a very interesting
which I love this is a very interesting
which I love this is a very interesting one is what is the state doing with the
one is what is the state doing with the
one is what is the state doing with the money and revenue they are no longer
money and revenue they are no longer
money and revenue they are no longer sharing
>> applying it to their budget
>> applying it to their budget >> they cut the revenue
>> they cut the revenue
>> they cut the revenue >> well how about that they they you know
>> well how about that they they you know
>> well how about that they they you know whether you agree or disagree with this
whether you agree or disagree with this
whether you agree or disagree with this it's me again it comes back to best
it's me again it comes back to best
it's me again it comes back to best practice
practice
practice and they they developed this voucher
and they they developed this voucher
and they they developed this voucher system for education that they just
system for education that they just
system for education that they just opened the door up more so with and and
opened the door up more so with and and
opened the door up more so with and and the bottom line for me is then don't
the bottom line for me is then don't
the bottom line for me is then don't take away don't take away the revenue on
take away don't take away the revenue on
take away don't take away the revenue on the other side that's my my thing you
the other side that's my my thing you
the other side that's my my thing you have the right to do what you want to do
have the right to do what you want to do
have the right to do what you want to do but make a good business decision
but make a good business decision
but make a good business decision because that's what we have to do
because that's what we have to do
because that's what we have to do >> I think what's been happening is as they
>> I think what's been happening is as they
>> I think what's been happening is as they are trying to balance their budget and
are trying to balance their budget and
are trying to balance their budget and their revenues are declining they look
their revenues are declining they look
their revenues are declining they look for ways to cut as well. That would be
for ways to cut as well. That would be
for ways to cut as well. That would be this the simple answer.
this the simple answer.
this the simple answer. >> Very
hand to Rob.
hand to Rob. >> You know, that's a really good good
>> You know, that's a really good good
>> You know, that's a really good good question. Um I'm not sure if expenses
question. Um I'm not sure if expenses
question. Um I'm not sure if expenses are are, you know, their costs are going
are are, you know, their costs are going
are are, you know, their costs are going down while their revenues go down. But
down while their revenues go down. But
down while their revenues go down. But as we look internally and and this year
as we look internally and and this year
as we look internally and and this year we had to reduce our budget by a number
we had to reduce our budget by a number
we had to reduce our budget by a number of positions to kind of make a little
of positions to kind of make a little
of positions to kind of make a little bit more sense of it. I'm not sure if
bit more sense of it. I'm not sure if
bit more sense of it. I'm not sure if that's happening um more universally at
that's happening um more universally at
that's happening um more universally at the state level. So, I mean, it's a
the state level. So, I mean, it's a
the state level. So, I mean, it's a great question and something that we
great question and something that we
great question and something that we should probably demand answers for. I
should probably demand answers for. I
should probably demand answers for. I know everyone's trying to balance their
know everyone's trying to balance their
know everyone's trying to balance their budgets, but are you also reducing your
budgets, but are you also reducing your
budgets, but are you also reducing your costs,
costs,
costs, not by shifting these expenses to the
not by shifting these expenses to the
not by shifting these expenses to the localities, but your statewide costs?
localities, but your statewide costs?
localities, but your statewide costs? So, that's a that's a great question
So, that's a that's a great question
So, that's a that's a great question that we'd love that
that we'd love that
that we'd love that >> Well, Rob, hold on to the microphone.
>> Well, Rob, hold on to the microphone.
>> Well, Rob, hold on to the microphone. I'm gonna I'm going to combine two
I'm gonna I'm going to combine two
I'm gonna I'm going to combine two questions because I think they're a
questions because I think they're a
questions because I think they're a little import more very important. And
little import more very important. And
little import more very important. And let's talk about that SWEP funding. And
let's talk about that SWEP funding. And
let's talk about that SWEP funding. And the question is asking essentially we're
the question is asking essentially we're
the question is asking essentially we're seeing wealthier communities actually
seeing wealthier communities actually
seeing wealthier communities actually have a lower tax rate than some of these
have a lower tax rate than some of these
have a lower tax rate than some of these other communities and that directly
other communities and that directly
other communities and that directly affects that's directly affected by the
affects that's directly affected by the
affects that's directly affected by the swept. Could you kind of talk about that
swept. Could you kind of talk about that
swept. Could you kind of talk about that a little bit? Yeah, I mean if you think
a little bit? Yeah, I mean if you think
a little bit? Yeah, I mean if you think I I think Elizabeth touched on it, you
I I think Elizabeth touched on it, you
I I think Elizabeth touched on it, you know, uh places with waterfront
know, uh places with waterfront
know, uh places with waterfront properties that have higher um
properties that have higher um
properties that have higher um valuations are generating a lot more
valuations are generating a lot more
valuations are generating a lot more revenue, but they might not necessarily
revenue, but they might not necessarily
revenue, but they might not necessarily have the expenses that come from places
have the expenses that come from places
have the expenses that come from places like Berlin, Keane, Claremont, Conquer,
like Berlin, Keane, Claremont, Conquer,
like Berlin, Keane, Claremont, Conquer, Manchester, NSHA. And so that money that
Manchester, NSHA. And so that money that
Manchester, NSHA. And so that money that they're actually able to generate in
they're actually able to generate in
they're actually able to generate in their in their um location with property
their in their um location with property
their in their um location with property taxes never actually leaves that where
taxes never actually leaves that where
taxes never actually leaves that where as I was referring to before, you know,
as I was referring to before, you know,
as I was referring to before, you know, there was a point in time where all of
there was a point in time where all of
there was a point in time where all of that money went into a pot and then it
that money went into a pot and then it
that money went into a pot and then it was disseminated a little bit more
was disseminated a little bit more
was disseminated a little bit more evenly, a little bit more fairly to help
evenly, a little bit more fairly to help
evenly, a little bit more fairly to help all the ships rise and not just, you
all the ships rise and not just, you
all the ships rise and not just, you know, the folks who had all the money.
know, the folks who had all the money.
know, the folks who had all the money. >> Elizabeth, do you want to add to that at
>> Elizabeth, do you want to add to that at
>> Elizabeth, do you want to add to that at all?
all?
all? >> Mystery. I can give a little bit more
>> Mystery. I can give a little bit more
>> Mystery. I can give a little bit more history. Um, and when that was
history. Um, and when that was
history. Um, and when that was happening, towns and cities were
happening, towns and cities were
happening, towns and cities were fighting it out over you're taking my
fighting it out over you're taking my
fighting it out over you're taking my money, I'm contributing to this fund and
money, I'm contributing to this fund and
money, I'm contributing to this fund and now it's going to you and that's not
now it's going to you and that's not
now it's going to you and that's not fair. Which is why New Hampshire
fair. Which is why New Hampshire
fair. Which is why New Hampshire Municipal Association doesn't usually
Municipal Association doesn't usually
Municipal Association doesn't usually get into the middle of it because they
get into the middle of it because they
get into the middle of it because they don't want to be advocating for one
don't want to be advocating for one
don't want to be advocating for one community over the other. But there were
community over the other. But there were
community over the other. But there were a lot of politics that went with that
a lot of politics that went with that
a lot of politics that went with that program.
program.
program. Margaret, this question is for you. When
Margaret, this question is for you. When
Margaret, this question is for you. When does the state conclude that
does the state conclude that
does the state conclude that downshifting is not sustainable?
>> When does the state conclude that?
>> When does the state conclude that? >> That's a question from you all.
>> That's a question from you all.
>> That's a question from you all. >> Um,
>> Um,
>> Um, >> at what point are we no longer at the
>> at what point are we no longer at the
>> at what point are we no longer at the precipice, let's say, but we've fallen
precipice, let's say, but we've fallen
precipice, let's say, but we've fallen off the cliff and we haven't at the
off the cliff and we haven't at the
off the cliff and we haven't at the bottom yet.
bottom yet.
bottom yet. >> I ask myself this every bianium, every
>> I ask myself this every bianium, every
>> I ask myself this every bianium, every state budget process. I ask myself that
state budget process. I ask myself that
state budget process. I ask myself that question. What's what will be the
question. What's what will be the
question. What's what will be the breaking point where this can't happen
breaking point where this can't happen
breaking point where this can't happen anymore and somehow we have not hit it
anymore and somehow we have not hit it
anymore and somehow we have not hit it yet? And part of the issue is that prop
yet? And part of the issue is that prop
yet? And part of the issue is that prop property taxes
property taxes
property taxes in theory are an unlimited pot of money
in theory are an unlimited pot of money
in theory are an unlimited pot of money in the sense that they can just keep
in the sense that they can just keep
in the sense that they can just keep going up, right? And so because there's
going up, right? And so because there's
going up, right? And so because there's not a specific backs stop on it and
not a specific backs stop on it and
not a specific backs stop on it and because property taxes happen separately
because property taxes happen separately
because property taxes happen separately from the state budget process, there's a
from the state budget process, there's a
from the state budget process, there's a disconnect
disconnect
disconnect between state policy and property taxes.
between state policy and property taxes.
between state policy and property taxes. And there's a disconnect for for people
And there's a disconnect for for people
And there's a disconnect for for people too, right? because you you see your
too, right? because you you see your
too, right? because you you see your property tax bill and it's coming from
property tax bill and it's coming from
property tax bill and it's coming from the city or town and that's how it's
the city or town and that's how it's
the city or town and that's how it's viewed and there's not a direct line
viewed and there's not a direct line
viewed and there's not a direct line being made between state policy and what
being made between state policy and what
being made between state policy and what you're seeing in your property tax bill.
you're seeing in your property tax bill.
you're seeing in your property tax bill. So there's levels of disconnect
So there's levels of disconnect
So there's levels of disconnect so that that make it difficult for me to
so that that make it difficult for me to
so that that make it difficult for me to answer the question of when we haven't
answer the question of when we haven't
answer the question of when we haven't hit when somehow
hit when somehow
hit when somehow >> we keep saying there.
>> we keep saying there.
>> we keep saying there. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Yeah, it's a great question.
Yeah, it's a great question.
Yeah, it's a great question. >> So, following up in that vein, what
>> So, following up in that vein, what
>> So, following up in that vein, what would be the top two to three most
would be the top two to three most
would be the top two to three most impactful things we can do as a
impactful things we can do as a
impactful things we can do as a community to combat the downshifting of
community to combat the downshifting of
community to combat the downshifting of costs?
costs?
costs? We need to be more aggressive during the
We need to be more aggressive during the
We need to be more aggressive during the legislative process and um f we we at
legislative process and um f we we at
legislative process and um f we we at the city follow the bills and I am
the city follow the bills and I am
the city follow the bills and I am really appreciative that we are a member
really appreciative that we are a member
really appreciative that we are a member of the New Hampshire Municipal
of the New Hampshire Municipal
of the New Hampshire Municipal Association and they put out a list and
Association and they put out a list and
Association and they put out a list and they track bills for us and we sign up
they track bills for us and we sign up
they track bills for us and we sign up for the bill trackers for all that you
for the bill trackers for all that you
for the bill trackers for all that you know the different departments and what
know the different departments and what
know the different departments and what the impacts are and then honestly we
the impacts are and then honestly we
the impacts are and then honestly we wait until about crossover because the
wait until about crossover because the
wait until about crossover because the craziness is usually ually done by then.
craziness is usually ually done by then.
craziness is usually ually done by then. Um there's a lot of bills that come out
Um there's a lot of bills that come out
Um there's a lot of bills that come out before we get to crossover that are
before we get to crossover that are
before we get to crossover that are taken care of till you get there. And
taken care of till you get there. And
taken care of till you get there. And when you get to crossover, it's becomes
when you get to crossover, it's becomes
when you get to crossover, it's becomes really important because those bills are
really important because those bills are
really important because those bills are still alive and you know you need to to
still alive and you know you need to to
still alive and you know you need to to weigh in and so being active in the
weigh in and so being active in the
weigh in and so being active in the legislative process I think would be
legislative process I think would be
legislative process I think would be helpful. Um the other thing and Margaret
helpful. Um the other thing and Margaret
helpful. Um the other thing and Margaret knows this but I feel that towns and
knows this but I feel that towns and
knows this but I feel that towns and cities need to band together on the
cities need to band together on the
cities need to band together on the school funding issue. I I know it's not
school funding issue. I I know it's not
school funding issue. I I know it's not under my budget. Uh you know, it's not
under my budget. Uh you know, it's not
under my budget. Uh you know, it's not something I don't put together the
something I don't put together the
something I don't put together the school budget. I don't have authority. I
school budget. I don't have authority. I
school budget. I don't have authority. I don't do really anything except for we
don't do really anything except for we
don't do really anything except for we collect the taxes. Um so that's why we
collect the taxes. Um so that's why we
collect the taxes. Um so that's why we haven't as a municipality or as a group
haven't as a municipality or as a group
haven't as a municipality or as a group of m municipalities, we have um an
of m municipalities, we have um an
of m municipalities, we have um an association of towns and cities and we
association of towns and cities and we
association of towns and cities and we can get together and say this is not
can get together and say this is not
can get together and say this is not right because it's going to continue to
right because it's going to continue to
right because it's going to continue to create an issue for us. um as we move
create an issue for us. um as we move
create an issue for us. um as we move forward if we do not address that school
forward if we do not address that school
forward if we do not address that school funding issue.
>> And I I love your answer. Making your
>> And I I love your answer. Making your voice heard is really really important.
voice heard is really really important.
voice heard is really really important. And we've we've seen that have some
And we've we've seen that have some
And we've we've seen that have some impact, but maybe not as much of an
impact, but maybe not as much of an
impact, but maybe not as much of an impact as we would like to see. I I've
impact as we would like to see. I I've
impact as we would like to see. I I've seen pieces of legislation as it's moved
seen pieces of legislation as it's moved
seen pieces of legislation as it's moved through the process be very lopsided
through the process be very lopsided
through the process be very lopsided with public input. you know, to the
with public input. you know, to the
with public input. you know, to the extent of like 5,000 who are opposed and
extent of like 5,000 who are opposed and
extent of like 5,000 who are opposed and 70 who support that, you know, still go
70 who support that, you know, still go
70 who support that, you know, still go through and and so that's a little bit
through and and so that's a little bit
through and and so that's a little bit concerning. So, I go back to the make
concerning. So, I go back to the make
concerning. So, I go back to the make sure you're paying attention in November
sure you're paying attention in November
sure you're paying attention in November of who you're signing up for. You know,
of who you're signing up for. You know,
of who you're signing up for. You know, really analyze what they stand for, what
really analyze what they stand for, what
really analyze what they stand for, what they believe in, and what they're going
they believe in, and what they're going
they believe in, and what they're going to do to represent you. I would welcome
to do to represent you. I would welcome
to do to represent you. I would welcome the day where it felt like granite sters
the day where it felt like granite sters
the day where it felt like granite sters mattered more than specific agendas that
mattered more than specific agendas that
mattered more than specific agendas that we see coming out of our capital.
>> I have a lot of questions up here
>> I have a lot of questions up here >> just just real quickly on this. Not yet.
>> just just real quickly on this. Not yet.
>> just just real quickly on this. Not yet. Um,
Um,
Um, I think I think the other thing you can
I think I think the other thing you can
I think I think the other thing you can do is um, you know, the county has a
do is um, you know, the county has a
do is um, you know, the county has a podcast, you have a podcast, uh, we have
podcast, you have a podcast, uh, we have
podcast, you have a podcast, uh, we have once a month I'm on the radio, we have a
once a month I'm on the radio, we have a
once a month I'm on the radio, we have a web page, we have a Facebook page, you
web page, we have a Facebook page, you
web page, we have a Facebook page, you know, I'm part of the New Hampshire
know, I'm part of the New Hampshire
know, I'm part of the New Hampshire Association of Counties, I'm on their
Association of Counties, I'm on their
Association of Counties, I'm on their executive uh, committee and that we have
executive uh, committee and that we have
executive uh, committee and that we have every Friday at 1:00, we have the uh,
every Friday at 1:00, we have the uh,
every Friday at 1:00, we have the uh, the legislative committee that goes
the legislative committee that goes
the legislative committee that goes through every single bill just like you
through every single bill just like you
through every single bill just like you do and we we plan the plan of action for
do and we we plan the plan of action for
do and we we plan the plan of action for what we're going to do X. So, but but
what we're going to do X. So, but but
what we're going to do X. So, but but more importantly, every Wednesday 8:30,
more importantly, every Wednesday 8:30,
more importantly, every Wednesday 8:30, you can join us on Zoom or in person. We
you can join us on Zoom or in person. We
you can join us on Zoom or in person. We have a a commissioner meeting um where
have a a commissioner meeting um where
have a a commissioner meeting um where you can come and listen to the
you can come and listen to the
you can come and listen to the discussions of what we're doing. It's
discussions of what we're doing. It's
discussions of what we're doing. It's always interesting. Um there's good
always interesting. Um there's good
always interesting. Um there's good laughter at times and some serious
laughter at times and some serious
laughter at times and some serious talking going on at the same time of
talking going on at the same time of
talking going on at the same time of seeing how we're going to move forward.
seeing how we're going to move forward.
seeing how we're going to move forward. And again, really educate yourself to
And again, really educate yourself to
And again, really educate yourself to when you go into the voting booth of
when you go into the voting booth of
when you go into the voting booth of who's going to represent you in a way
who's going to represent you in a way
who's going to represent you in a way that that meets the needs that we're
that that meets the needs that we're
that that meets the needs that we're looking for. That that's as easy as
looking for. That that's as easy as
looking for. That that's as easy as that.
that.
that. >> May I? I'm just kidding. Um, you know, I
>> May I? I'm just kidding. Um, you know, I
>> May I? I'm just kidding. Um, you know, I think that's really important what they
think that's really important what they
think that's really important what they just mentioned and it's a really good
just mentioned and it's a really good
just mentioned and it's a really good question. It's actually from our um our
question. It's actually from our um our
question. It's actually from our um our counselor Karen Leo Hill. appreciate
counselor Karen Leo Hill. appreciate
counselor Karen Leo Hill. appreciate this one because I've heard this a lot
this one because I've heard this a lot
this one because I've heard this a lot in conquered as well that we are hearing
in conquered as well that we are hearing
in conquered as well that we are hearing that um this the municipalities are to
that um this the municipalities are to
that um this the municipalities are to blame. It's not the state's fault. It is
blame. It's not the state's fault. It is
blame. It's not the state's fault. It is the municipality's fault. And I was
the municipality's fault. And I was
the municipality's fault. And I was wondering how you guys respond to that.
wondering how you guys respond to that.
wondering how you guys respond to that. You responded a little today, but you
You responded a little today, but you
You responded a little today, but you know being a legislator up in conquered
know being a legislator up in conquered
know being a legislator up in conquered it's always your fault. It's never the
it's always your fault. It's never the
it's always your fault. It's never the state's fault.
>> So that's I have been hearing that as
>> So that's I have been hearing that as well. And um I guess I would say I don't
well. And um I guess I would say I don't
well. And um I guess I would say I don't have the luxury of balancing our budget
have the luxury of balancing our budget
have the luxury of balancing our budget on the backs of the state of New
on the backs of the state of New
on the backs of the state of New Hampshire. And so I'm not sure why they
Hampshire. And so I'm not sure why they
Hampshire. And so I'm not sure why they feel they have that luxury with
feel they have that luxury with
feel they have that luxury with municipalities
>> with
>> with exception of course. All right. So you
exception of course. All right. So you
exception of course. All right. So you know this is not personal. I I I think
know this is not personal. I I I think
know this is not personal. I I I think it's important to know that the people
it's important to know that the people
it's important to know that the people up here on the panel actually live here
up here on the panel actually live here
up here on the panel actually live here in the community and so those tax
in the community and so those tax
in the community and so those tax impacts impact us as well and there's
impacts impact us as well and there's
impacts impact us as well and there's nobody up here who is deliberately
nobody up here who is deliberately
nobody up here who is deliberately saying, "Hey, look, we've got to do what
saying, "Hey, look, we've got to do what
saying, "Hey, look, we've got to do what we can to like raise these property
we can to like raise these property
we can to like raise these property taxes." You know, we're trying to
taxes." You know, we're trying to
taxes." You know, we're trying to provide services for our community. I
provide services for our community. I
provide services for our community. I was in Berlin a couple of weeks ago and
was in Berlin a couple of weeks ago and
was in Berlin a couple of weeks ago and somebody had shared with me um you know
somebody had shared with me um you know
somebody had shared with me um you know what do you tell the adults who are
what do you tell the adults who are
what do you tell the adults who are saying that the public schools are
saying that the public schools are
saying that the public schools are failing and we should shut down the
failing and we should shut down the
failing and we should shut down the whole public school system and and my
whole public school system and and my
whole public school system and and my response was well what's the alternative
response was well what's the alternative
response was well what's the alternative do you want to have a community that
do you want to have a community that
do you want to have a community that doesn't have educated children coming
doesn't have educated children coming
doesn't have educated children coming through what's that going to mean what
through what's that going to mean what
through what's that going to mean what is that going to look like if you're not
is that going to look like if you're not
is that going to look like if you're not providing a solid foundation and I
providing a solid foundation and I
providing a solid foundation and I believe we've got outstanding schools um
believe we've got outstanding schools um
believe we've got outstanding schools um I I honestly do otherwise maybe I
I I honestly do otherwise maybe I
I I honestly do otherwise maybe I wouldn't have my own children in our
wouldn't have my own children in our
wouldn't have my own children in our school system. Um but if we don't have a
school system. Um but if we don't have a
school system. Um but if we don't have a solid background for our kids to learn
solid background for our kids to learn
solid background for our kids to learn what does that look like? What does that
what does that look like? What does that
what does that look like? What does that mean? What does that mean for our
mean? What does that mean for our
mean? What does that mean for our community? The dynamics you know how are
community? The dynamics you know how are
community? The dynamics you know how are people you know gain being gainfully
people you know gain being gainfully
people you know gain being gainfully employed if they don't have an education
employed if they don't have an education
employed if they don't have an education system. Interestingly right public
system. Interestingly right public
system. Interestingly right public schools I mentioned are very highly
schools I mentioned are very highly
schools I mentioned are very highly regulated. One of the things that also
regulated. One of the things that also
regulated. One of the things that also comes for with public schools is we're
comes for with public schools is we're
comes for with public schools is we're not we're not Burger King. And if
not we're not Burger King. And if
not we're not Burger King. And if anyone's a Burger King fan, this is not
anyone's a Burger King fan, this is not
anyone's a Burger King fan, this is not a dig on them. We don't have the right
a dig on them. We don't have the right
a dig on them. We don't have the right to refuse service to anyone who comes to
to refuse service to anyone who comes to
to refuse service to anyone who comes to our door. We take everyone. We don't,
our door. We take everyone. We don't,
our door. We take everyone. We don't, like other places, get to say, "Sorry,
like other places, get to say, "Sorry,
like other places, get to say, "Sorry, you don't quite fit our mold, so we're
you don't quite fit our mold, so we're
you don't quite fit our mold, so we're not going to enroll you." We take
not going to enroll you." We take
not going to enroll you." We take absolutely everyone. And we work really,
absolutely everyone. And we work really,
absolutely everyone. And we work really, really hard. our staff, our teachers,
really hard. our staff, our teachers,
really hard. our staff, our teachers, our administrators, our counselors, our
our administrators, our counselors, our
our administrators, our counselors, our nurses, our paras, all of our folks, our
nurses, our paras, all of our folks, our
nurses, our paras, all of our folks, our custodians, our maintenance crews, they
custodians, our maintenance crews, they
custodians, our maintenance crews, they work really, really hard to provide an
work really, really hard to provide an
work really, really hard to provide an environment where kids can gain value.
environment where kids can gain value.
environment where kids can gain value. And and I've said this in a number of
And and I've said this in a number of
And and I've said this in a number of different public settings. We are the
different public settings. We are the
different public settings. We are the opposite of of of Gosh, Senator, you're
opposite of of of Gosh, Senator, you're
opposite of of of Gosh, Senator, you're going to think I'm picking on you. Um,
going to think I'm picking on you. Um,
going to think I'm picking on you. Um, car dealerships, right? When you
turn off his mic.
turn off his mic. >> And the softball question,
>> And the softball question,
>> And the softball question, >> I know. Yeah.
>> I know. Yeah.
>> I know. Yeah. >> And and look, that's not it's not a
>> And and look, that's not it's not a
>> And and look, that's not it's not a secret. When you buy a new car and you
secret. When you buy a new car and you
secret. When you buy a new car and you drive off the lot, what happens to the
drive off the lot, what happens to the
drive off the lot, what happens to the value of that car? You know, the second
value of that car? You know, the second
value of that car? You know, the second you drive it off the lot. It's not a
you drive it off the lot. It's not a
you drive it off the lot. It's not a reflection of the quality of car that
reflection of the quality of car that
reflection of the quality of car that you're getting, but I mean, it's just
you're getting, but I mean, it's just
you're getting, but I mean, it's just the reality. The moment you drive off
the reality. The moment you drive off
the reality. The moment you drive off the lot, the price of or the value of
the lot, the price of or the value of
the lot, the price of or the value of that decreases. When a kid comes into
that decreases. When a kid comes into
that decreases. When a kid comes into our classes into our schools on day one,
our classes into our schools on day one,
our classes into our schools on day one, by the time they leave on day 180, our
by the time they leave on day 180, our
by the time they leave on day 180, our expectation is that you're doing the
expectation is that you're doing the
expectation is that you're doing the opposite of what happens when you buy a
opposite of what happens when you buy a
opposite of what happens when you buy a new car. You are adding value. And I
new car. You are adding value. And I
new car. You are adding value. And I believe that our staff are doing an
believe that our staff are doing an
believe that our staff are doing an outstanding job of doing that.
outstanding job of doing that.
outstanding job of doing that. Regardless of whether it's an elementary
Regardless of whether it's an elementary
Regardless of whether it's an elementary or the middle school or the high school,
or the middle school or the high school,
or the middle school or the high school, one of our town schools, I think they're
one of our town schools, I think they're
one of our town schools, I think they're all working really hard to add value to
all working really hard to add value to
all working really hard to add value to students. The difference is they're all
students. The difference is they're all
students. The difference is they're all coming in at different levels whereas
coming in at different levels whereas
coming in at different levels whereas some other institutions might have
some other institutions might have
some other institutions might have enrollment requirements that they can
enrollment requirements that they can
enrollment requirements that they can say no. We don't have that uh that
say no. We don't have that uh that
say no. We don't have that uh that luxury to say no, we take everyone.
>> All right. Well, well, well, thank you
>> All right. Well, well, well, thank you guys. You know, we had a lot of
guys. You know, we had a lot of
guys. You know, we had a lot of questions here and just for the sake of
questions here and just for the sake of
questions here and just for the sake of time and folks getting home tonight, I'm
time and folks getting home tonight, I'm
time and folks getting home tonight, I'm going to make photo copies of these,
going to make photo copies of these,
going to make photo copies of these, share them with the panelists. I'm also
share them with the panelists. I'm also
share them with the panelists. I'm also going to keep them as well because a lot
going to keep them as well because a lot
going to keep them as well because a lot of them are prevalent to the state. So,
of them are prevalent to the state. So,
of them are prevalent to the state. So, if you guys want to answer these
if you guys want to answer these
if you guys want to answer these questions, p please follow up with one
questions, p please follow up with one
questions, p please follow up with one of us because we will do that. I just
of us because we will do that. I just
of us because we will do that. I just want to give the panelists one more
want to give the panelists one more
want to give the panelists one more opportunity to just say your final words
opportunity to just say your final words
opportunity to just say your final words before we end tonight.
>> So, Senator, I want to thank you for
>> So, Senator, I want to thank you for organizing this event this evening. I
organizing this event this evening. I
organizing this event this evening. I think it's a very important topic and
think it's a very important topic and
think it's a very important topic and one that we've been talking about at the
one that we've been talking about at the
one that we've been talking about at the city of Keen. I also want to thank you
city of Keen. I also want to thank you
city of Keen. I also want to thank you for the work that you've done on behalf
for the work that you've done on behalf
for the work that you've done on behalf of the city of Keen um around
of the city of Keen um around
of the city of Keen um around homelessness and reimbursements and that
homelessness and reimbursements and that
homelessness and reimbursements and that is an entirely separate meeting we could
is an entirely separate meeting we could
is an entirely separate meeting we could have on how that system is really broken
have on how that system is really broken
have on how that system is really broken in the state of New Hampshire as well.
in the state of New Hampshire as well.
in the state of New Hampshire as well. And I want to thank you because you
And I want to thank you because you
And I want to thank you because you helped us here at the city get a bill
helped us here at the city get a bill
helped us here at the city get a bill passed um that we are now able to get
passed um that we are now able to get
passed um that we are now able to get reimbursed uh from other communities
reimbursed uh from other communities
reimbursed uh from other communities when we have homeless here. So from
when we have homeless here. So from
when we have homeless here. So from another city
Um, I just want to say thank you for
Um, I just want to say thank you for everybody turning out. Um, I'll stick
everybody turning out. Um, I'll stick
everybody turning out. Um, I'll stick around if you want to ask me some
around if you want to ask me some
around if you want to ask me some questions that you may have. Not a
questions that you may have. Not a
questions that you may have. Not a problem. Uh, two, uh, is could the
problem. Uh, two, uh, is could the
problem. Uh, two, uh, is could the commissioners just stand up and wave so
commissioners just stand up and wave so
commissioners just stand up and wave so everybody knows. Uh, Terry Clark,
everybody knows. Uh, Terry Clark,
everybody knows. Uh, Terry Clark, Claudia Stewart, Skip D Bernardo. Thank
Claudia Stewart, Skip D Bernardo. Thank
Claudia Stewart, Skip D Bernardo. Thank you very much.
you very much.
you very much. And then any state rep that's here
And then any state rep that's here
And then any state rep that's here tonight, could you just stand up,
tonight, could you just stand up,
tonight, could you just stand up, please?
please?
please? >> State reps.
>> State reps.
>> State reps. Thank you very much. It's Oh.
Thank you very much. It's Oh.
Thank you very much. It's Oh. >> Oh, and he cannot since he has done
>> Oh, and he cannot since he has done
>> Oh, and he cannot since he has done that. I have the mayor, Mayor Khan, in
that. I have the mayor, Mayor Khan, in
that. I have the mayor, Mayor Khan, in the front row. Thank you very much for
the front row. Thank you very much for
the front row. Thank you very much for your support. And I also have several
your support. And I also have several
your support. And I also have several city councilors in the room. If you can
city councilors in the room. If you can
city councilors in the room. If you can stand up for one second.
stand up for one second.
stand up for one second. Thank you for your support.
Thank you for your support.
Thank you for your support. >> I just think that this is an important
>> I just think that this is an important
>> I just think that this is an important conversation that doesn't stop tonight.
conversation that doesn't stop tonight.
conversation that doesn't stop tonight. It needs to be continued. know that I
It needs to be continued. know that I
It needs to be continued. know that I know that I can speak for all of us that
know that I can speak for all of us that
know that I can speak for all of us that I mean we're open to having
I mean we're open to having
I mean we're open to having conversations on a regular basis if
conversations on a regular basis if
conversations on a regular basis if you'd like to have us do this down the
you'd like to have us do this down the
you'd like to have us do this down the road at some point again you know and
road at some point again you know and
road at some point again you know and we're willing to do that I know that
we're willing to do that I know that
we're willing to do that I know that again we've gone in the county to 22
again we've gone in the county to 22
again we've gone in the county to 22 towns and had this conversation if
towns and had this conversation if
towns and had this conversation if anybody knows anybody in Roxberry that
anybody knows anybody in Roxberry that
anybody knows anybody in Roxberry that we can find find the selectman to have
we can find find the selectman to have
we can find find the selectman to have the meeting that would be great and
the meeting that would be great and
the meeting that would be great and we're working on that but it's really
we're working on that but it's really
we're working on that but it's really important to educate ourselves so that
important to educate ourselves so that
important to educate ourselves so that you you don't go with a lot of
you you don't go with a lot of
you you don't go with a lot of misinformation that's out there at times
misinformation that's out there at times
misinformation that's out there at times and that we can have civil conversations
and that we can have civil conversations
and that we can have civil conversations in this day and age I think is healthy
in this day and age I think is healthy
in this day and age I think is healthy for all of us
for all of us
for all of us >> and absolutely and everyone thank you so
>> and absolutely and everyone thank you so
>> and absolutely and everyone thank you so much for being here. I want to recognize
much for being here. I want to recognize
much for being here. I want to recognize our executive counselor Karen Leo Hill
our executive counselor Karen Leo Hill
our executive counselor Karen Leo Hill who's also here as well. So
and and I and I and Margaret or Rob you
and and I and I and Margaret or Rob you got one last
got one last
got one last >> Yeah. No, I mean because we are
>> Yeah. No, I mean because we are
>> Yeah. No, I mean because we are recognizing a lot of other folks I'd
recognizing a lot of other folks I'd
recognizing a lot of other folks I'd love for as a person who has 33 bosses
love for as a person who has 33 bosses
love for as a person who has 33 bosses because I have 33 school board members
because I have 33 school board members
because I have 33 school board members that I answer to. Would would the folks
that I answer to. Would would the folks
that I answer to. Would would the folks who are on the school boards throughout
who are on the school boards throughout
who are on the school boards throughout all of our seven districts please just
all of our seven districts please just
all of our seven districts please just sort of stand up so folks can
sort of stand up so folks can
sort of stand up so folks can >> recognize that as well.
And just to echo Chris's uh comments, I
And just to echo Chris's uh comments, I think it's really important that we can
think it's really important that we can
think it's really important that we can come together in a in a setting like
come together in a in a setting like
come together in a in a setting like this. and thank you for making the time
this. and thank you for making the time
this. and thank you for making the time to be here and have a very civil
to be here and have a very civil
to be here and have a very civil conversation about something that really
conversation about something that really
conversation about something that really gets under all of our skins. It's not
gets under all of our skins. It's not
gets under all of our skins. It's not unique to any individual. I think we're
unique to any individual. I think we're
unique to any individual. I think we're all in the same boat and so I appreciate
all in the same boat and so I appreciate
all in the same boat and so I appreciate your organization, your leadership,
your organization, your leadership,
your organization, your leadership, Senator, and I appreciate everyone
Senator, and I appreciate everyone
Senator, and I appreciate everyone taking the time to be here tonight. So,
taking the time to be here tonight. So,
taking the time to be here tonight. So, thank you.
thank you.
thank you. >> Thank you. I thank you everyone. Um, and
>> Thank you. I thank you everyone. Um, and
>> Thank you. I thank you everyone. Um, and I would just I would just echo what the
I would just I would just echo what the
I would just I would just echo what the panelists say. Stay informed, ask
panelists say. Stay informed, ask
panelists say. Stay informed, ask questions, talk to your elected leaders,
questions, talk to your elected leaders,
questions, talk to your elected leaders, talk to your municipal municipal
talk to your municipal municipal
talk to your municipal municipal leaders, and just figure out what's
leaders, and just figure out what's
leaders, and just figure out what's going on and don't be afraid to ask
going on and don't be afraid to ask
going on and don't be afraid to ask questions because there's a lot of
questions because there's a lot of
questions because there's a lot of misinformation out there and a lot of
misinformation out there and a lot of
misinformation out there and a lot of confusion about how things affect you.
confusion about how things affect you.
confusion about how things affect you. So again, folks, thank you much, and um,
So again, folks, thank you much, and um,
So again, folks, thank you much, and um, hope to see you soon. Enjoy your night.